**From:** Matt Bibee (*mbibee@rocketchips.com*)

**Date:** Fri Mar 02 2001 - 10:36:28 PST

**Next message:**Jian X. Zheng: "RE: [SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"**Previous message:**D. C. Sessions: "Re: [SI-LIST] : so-dimm simulation models......"**In reply to:**Denomme, Paul S.: "[SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"**Next in thread:**Jian X. Zheng: "RE: [SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"**Reply:**Jian X. Zheng: "RE: [SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"

Your tool should give you the per meter RLGC matrices at your desired

frequency. The classic equation is:

alpha=Re{sqrt[(R + jwL)(G +jwC)]} where alpha is in Nepers/m. I forget the

conversion factor. That's the total loss. Is there an advantage to seperating

loss into conductor and dielectric? If you have it available the hspice W

element can accept RLGC params in matrix format and will model skin and

dielectric loss.

"Denomme, Paul S." wrote:

*> I am currently working on a job and have a microstrip trace on
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*> GETEK. The trace width is 33 mils 1/2 oz., running at 1GHz, 75 ohms, Dk of
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*> 3.9, and Loss tangent of .01. I am trying to calculate the total conductive
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*> loss and the total dielectric losses for this microstrip case. For
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*> conductive losses I obtained 0.189dB/M which seems correct to me. I
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*> obtained this result from Ansoft 2D analyzer. I am also trying to determine
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*> the dielectric losses for this trace but I am not sure if I can use a
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*> formula for this calculation or not. The formula for dielectric loss I have
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*> is
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*>
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*> Ad=(27.3*SQR(Er)*LossTangent)/Wavelength
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*>
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*> The Ansoft software gave me an effective Dk of 2.88 which is .74 of the
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*> Dk=3.9. I am thinking that I could use the .74*Losstangent as the effective
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*> loss tangent and
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*> plug in the effective dielectric constant and the effective loss tangent
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*> into the above equation to get the dielectric losses. Can anyone tell me if
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*> I am way off base on this one? or am I right on the money?
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*>
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*> I would appreciate any feedback.
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*>
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*> Regards,
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*>
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*> Paul S. Denomme
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*> paul.denomme@viasystems.com
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*>
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**Next message:**Jian X. Zheng: "RE: [SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"**Previous message:**D. C. Sessions: "Re: [SI-LIST] : so-dimm simulation models......"**In reply to:**Denomme, Paul S.: "[SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"**Next in thread:**Jian X. Zheng: "RE: [SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"**Reply:**Jian X. Zheng: "RE: [SI-LIST] : Total Conductive and dielectric Losses for a microstrip trace"

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