Re: [SI-LIST] : Bad IBIS models! - Business thoughts

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From: Adrian Shiner (adrian.shiner@virgin.net)
Date: Fri Mar 17 2000 - 11:45:58 PST


You choose your engineering tools and you live with the consequences. It is
naive to expect the supplier of components to follow your choice like a
slave. So long as they are meeting their business objectives (generating
cash and profits), no matter how big you are, you will need to be very
persuasive as an individual organisation to make an effective influence on
their actions. Such business concepts as partnering come to mind. Partnering
does not mean that in practice you get raped as some companies seem to think
is the objective of the exercise.

Food for thought for any NOKIA and SUN MICROSYSTEMS readers, do not assume
that everyone in FARNBOROUGH, HAMPSHIRE, UK is pleased to see you when you
create light pollution from empty car parks....the European Union have an
interest in such anti ecology matters.

Until the backlash............

Adrian

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Young" <briany@ibmoto.com>
To: <si-list@silab.eng.sun.com>
Sent: 15 March 2000 23:42
Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] : Bad IBIS models!

> I can't vouch for what goes on in other companies or even
> my own. I see a very small part of a very large operation
> in a very large industry. Probably everyone is in just
> about the same boat, so making something happen is tough.
>
> With that disclaimer, then ...
>
> The generation and supply of consistently good IBIS models
> across the product line is quite an expensive proposition.
> It requires regular training, because I/O designers come
> and go, software, hardware validation, cataloging, maintenance,
> etc. The effort must span multiple organizations and
> geographic regions. A high-level effort would be required
> with significant funding (i.e. millions). Without such
> an effort, what you get are individual best efforts.
>
> The people who can make this happen do not read this list.
> How do you convince them to expend the resources to make
> consistently good IBIS models available to customers?
> You can't just say, "A bunch of people on the SI-LIST bitterly
> complain about the quality of IBIS models, and if we don't
> do something about it, we will lose sales."
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Brian
>
>
> Kim Helliwell wrote:
> >
> > Are any component vendors reading this list? I'm frustrated
> > with some of the excuses for IBIS models some of them
> > (naming no names) distribute on the web and elsewhere.
> >
> > Here are the problems I've seen so far:
> >
> > 1. Models that don't have a complete pin map
> > 2. Pin map does not match the data sheet.
> > 3. Files that specify all the pins, but some of the models referenced
> > don't exist in the file
> > 4. Driver models that don't have any rise and fall curves.
> > 5. dv/dt values that are *GIVEN* as 0.00000/0.00000.
> > (This is totally unacceptable by my signal integrity tools)
> > 6. dv/dt values that are *GIVEN* as -x.xxxx/y.yyyy
> > (that is, negative values specified; also not accepted by
> > my SI tools)
> > 7. Min/Typ/Max values or curves that are scrambled
> > ( Typ > Max, Min > Typ, Min > Max)
> > 8. VI and clamp curves that are discontinuous.
> >
> > My word to vendors: customers that use IBIS models are not that
> > easily fooled. We use ibischk3, we look at the curves with a graphing
> > utility, and we have conversion programs that choke on one or more
> > of these problems. We can look at a model and pretty quickly tell
> > whether it is a good or a bad one. And it's pretty clear over time
> > which vendors consistently provide good models, and which ones obviously
> > aren't interested in providing good models and consequently do a
> > half-assed job on them.
> >
> > We're watching, and we know who you are!
> >
> > Of course, vendors that don't supply models at all don't
> > even rate this much attention.
> >
> > OK, I feel better now. Anyone else?
> >
> > --
> > Kim Helliwell
> > Senior CAE Engineer
> > Acuson Corporation
> > Phone: 650 694 5030 FAX: 650 943 7260
> >
> > **** To unsubscribe from si-list or si-list-digest: send e-mail to
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>
> --
> ***************************************************************
> * Brian Young phone: (512) 996-6099 *
> * Somerset Design Center fax: (512) 996-7434 *
> * Motorola, Austin, TX brian.young@motorola.com *
> ***************************************************************
>
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