Re: [SI-LIST] : Clean sheet of paper

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From: Jim Freeman (freeman@broadcom.com)
Date: Wed Dec 22 1999 - 14:04:41 PST


Hi DC,
    You Are stuck with 3.3v technology on the ring , but the interior can be much higher performance with dual gat oxide processes.

Jim Freeman

"D. C. Sessions" wrote:

> Chris.H.Simon@gd-is.com wrote:
> >
> > DC,
> >
> > I like your suggestion to start with a clean sheet of paper and ask
> > ourselves what should be done to optimize the I/O design.
> >
> > In my experience working with computer system architects, they always want
> > more and more bandwidth, which in the past has meant more and more pins at
> > the boundary of an IC and more and more pins through connectors. And also
> > increased data rates. To combat the higher data rates (and associated
> > issues of noise, SSO, timing, ...) I have suggested to them to use
> > differential signalling. The complaint that I get back is that this takes
> > more pins. "I don't want to use two pins per signal when I can get twice
> > as many signals using single ended." they whine. Of course this isn't
> > really true since an increasing number of ground and power pins are
> > required, but system architects don't consider these since they don't show
> > up on any block diagram.
>
> That's what grouches like me are for :-)
> We make nuisances of ourselves pointing out that SSO effects are
> the #1 limiter on available performance. That using DC-balanced
> signaling cuts SSO effects more than the equivalent number of pins
> dedicated to power connections. That the balanced signals cause
> less crosstalk and less EMI. That they can cut the cost of their
> termination supplies dramatically and reduce the number of PWB layers
> required.
>
> Of course, if those considerations aren't important to them, then
> we'll be perfectly happy to charge extra for more advanced process
> technology, packaging, and core area to make up the difference.
>
> > If it is really true that "Padrings are some of the most expensive real
> > estate around, so pin count should be minimized." then why don't we start
> > using each precious location on the padring to get more than one signal?
>
> We do. For busses, we crank up the clock rate and lower the number of
> lines needed. If we have more bandwidth per pin than a single channel
> can use, we use packet burst protocols.
>
> > I'm suggesting keeping differential signalling to alleviate some of the SI
> > issues, but putting more than one logical signal on each differential pair.
>
> Basically broadband. The desirability of broadband depends a lot on both
> the nature of your traffic and the limitations of your interconnect. For
> short interconnects it's not really attractive for quite a while yet (we
> did a science project of this sort recently. No, I can't discuss it.)
>
> > With two logical signals per pair I'm back to the one signal to one wire
> > ratio that system architects love. See U.S. patent #5,872,813 "Dual
> > Differential and Binary Data Receiver Arrangement" as an example. Although
> > that patent refers to bipolar ECL-like circuits, I believe that some
> > similar concepts could be implemented in CMOS circuits.
> >
> > The added complexity of the driver and receiver (and a little more power
> > due to increased voltage swing) may be worth it if we gain one or more
> > logical signals for each precious pin on the IC.
>
> Don't underestimate the grief that that "little more ... voltage swing"
> causes. It really messes with your S/N ratio, but worst of all is the
> fact that it runs up against the voltage-scaling objective. If you use
> voltages larger than the native supply for a technology, you have to
> degrade performance to what might as well be the technology appropriate
> for that voltage. IOW, if you inisist on 3.3v signaling you're going to
> be stuck with 350 nm CMOS performance.
>
> > ***************************************************************
> >
> > With the year wrapping up and my inbox filling with
> > "Out of Office Autoresponse" messages, I thought I'd
> > kick off something more interesting than the joys of LVDS.
> >
> > In particular, what would we use for signaling if we could
> > start with a totally clean sheet of paper? Rather than
> > immediately jump to a solution, I'm looking for some criteria:
> >
> > * It has to be scalable. Given silicon technology trends, it
> > should migrate gracefully to lower-voltages and less
> > voltage-stress-tolerant semiconductors.
> >
> > * It has to be SI clean. Output impedance should be matched
> > (stringency variable) to the line across the switching range.
> > Inputs switchpoints should be symmetrical and well-defined
> > (ie differential receivers). Power plane proliferation
> > leads to bad SI and wasted money, so separate termination
> > supplies are a Bad Thing.
> >
> > * It has to be versatile. Single-ended, balanced single-ended, or
> > differential; multidrop or point-to-point; uni- or bidirectional;
> > all should be minor variations on the same system.
> >
> > * It should be economical. Wasted power is a Bad Thing, so low
> > swing is a must. Padrings are some of the most expensive real
> > estate around, so pincount should be minimized. Line termination
> > can dominate a PWB so KISS is the rule. Power supplies (esp.
> > ones that can both sink and source current) are expensive and
> > nasty to deal with, so do without (both for termination and
> > funny analog functions in the I/O circuits.)
> >
> > What can we add to the list? Remove? Priorities? (This is
> > engineering, we make tradeoffs.) Where does this take us?
> >
> > --
> > D. C. Sessions
> > dc.sessions@vlsi.com
> >
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>
> --
> D. C. Sessions
> dc.sessions@vlsi.com
>
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