++++++++++++++ Straight Keys... ++++++++++++++ From: "Max Moon" To: Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 23:37:03 -0500 Subject: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Buddy-- One of my favorite straight keys is the Kent from England (or imported by AlphaDelta). I found a used one through the ARRL classifieds for less than half the normal (but too high for me) price. It is large but I've wondered if that fact maybe helps it to have such a fine feel. Very positive. My other favorite is hard to find, a model 605 from Great Northern Telegraph in Denmark. I think the company's out of the key business but this clunky looking thing was designed primarily for maritime use & made maybe 30 yrs ago. I think some folks make a big deal of its having platinum contacts but I don't think that changes the feel of it. Another long arm (it's even larger than the Kent straight key). See one here: http://www.webx.dk/oz2cpu/key6.htm (the knob on top adjusts spacing, the knob under the lever arm sets tension in the horizontally-strung spring, the black enclosure is a heavy bakelite). Another internet buy & something under $50. My first "good" key was a HiMound 708 which I have & still use some of the time. Especially with a cover on it, a very nice key. (Their numbering is funny in that a 708 with a clear plastic cover is a 706 but if it has a dark plastic cover it is a 707, and if you put a 708 on a slightly taller base it becomes, of course, the 709, unless you put a clear plastic cover on it in which case it is now a 704--idiosyncratic, at the least!) Medium weight, the knurled knobs all stay put. I didn't care for the original button & bought their optional "mushroom knob with skirt" replacement & didn't like it, the mushroom's stem was too thin for me so I wrapped just the stem in several layers thick, black cotton tape & now I like holding the knob. But, regardless, I've come to prefer the others. Anyway, HiMound keys are at the Morse Express website. Another key whose feel is very nice is a WW2 surplus British military key with the forgetable name "KEY. WT. 8 AMP. No.2. MK IIIB". A collector's website said that there were more than 100 different models of the basic "WT 8-Amp" key, and the many varieties were made all over the world--New Zealand & Australia, USA, England. Some have more bakelite than others, some use one or two stamped parts, others are all cast, etc., etc. The differences sometimes are so obvious you wonder how it can have the same # as some of the others. Anyway, to see a sample that looks like mine (but probably is the MK II or the MK IIIC or ...;-) check out this page: http://www.chss.montclair.edu/~pererat/9145.jpg . You'll see the key can't be adjusted for tightness/looseness of the lever arm--like the HiMound, it has no trunion screws. The up-side of that fact is that there isn't any play in the arm & never will be. The key is very small & also light weight--it'd be ideal for backpacking with a little base under it, etc--and yet it has a solid big key feel. Best of all, these regularly show up on e-Bay for very modest prices (mine was about $20 from England). I did not like the J-37 with its leaf or cantilever spring because it felt too soft, not enough resistance to suit me. I didn't like the J-38 although it was "OK." Also, while "uncommon" & "hard to find" I eventually grew to dislike the VERY heavy & bombproof NATO key known far & near as the No5803-99-580-8558 . The feel on closing wasn't crisp--it sort of thudded shut instead of clicking. (Also in Tom Perrera's key collection: http://www.chss.montclair.edu/~pererat/9185.gif and in a Japanese internet collection at: http://foster2.hp.infoseek.co.jp/natokey.jpg ) I found mine on e-Bay from a ham in Hong Kong & was thrilled to get it for a very low price, even considering postage (almost nobody bid on it, I think it was too unknown to attract any attention, thank heaven!). I admire the beautiful innards, love being able to adjust the spacing with the indexed knob on the top, but the acid test is that I hardly ever use it. Looking at my own comments, I can see how completely subjective this all is. You can talk about keys in terms of design (for example, the NATO key is based on the beloved Swedish Ericsson pump design, the Kent gets it's resistance from a spring that is pulled, rather than compressed like the HiMound & J38, etc., etc.) but some chaps like a soft feel, or a low know position, etc., etc. I've enjoyed being able to try out different keys at a fairly low risk because I buy them used (& set limits so I don't spend too much) & can sell them afterwards for about the same amount if I don't like them. I am comfortable with a high knob position & like the mechanics of a long lever arm--considering where they pivot, there must be a real mechanical advantage. But the next guy, well, who's to say? As you mother might have said, sampling straight keys is a good, clean way to have fun! Max, k0max ++++++++++++++++ Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 07:42:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Daniel Reynolds Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) To: "Wallace, Andy" , elecraft at mailman.qth.net I have that "Navy key" (and I'm NOT a collector). A very nice OM/Elmer here in the US gave it to me about the time I was graduating from High School. It's built like a tank with it's cast iron design. I believe he got it from another OM who was in WWII. It is one piece I don't think I would ever depart with. It is very easy to hold with it's contoured knob. It doesn't travel with my K2, but it will definately be QRV on SKN (Dec 31). I'm glad to see someone else knows more about this key. Thanks and 73, Daniel/AA0NI --- "Wallace, Andy" wrote: > Same fellow has one of my personal favorites, the > 26003A "Navy" key: > > http://www.webx.dk/oz2cpu/key45.htm > > He says it's from England, but I believe these were > U.S. ++++++++++++++++ Reply-To: From: "Ron D'Eau Claire" To: Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 08:57:02 -0700 Of course there is the much maligned but ever-popular J-38 straight key of WWII origins. I have one that gets lots of regular use and I wouldn't part with it. A more "modern" version is the "Classic Oval" straight key made by Wm. M. Nye. Simple, rugged and dependable. Nye has several nice straight keys. See: http://www.morsex.com/nye/ As someone else pointed out, a key is so PERSONAL a choice, that they can't help but raise up passions about which is "best". Ron AC7AC K2 #1289 +++++++++++++++++ Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 16:56:07 +0100 To: elecraft at mailman.qth.net From: Trevor Day Reply-To: Trev at secornwall.com Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Whilst on the subject of old straight keys, my straight key is German and, I think, WW2 vintage. I'll post a couple of pics and would be interested to hear from anyone who recognises it. (Even if its just to translate the German text) http://www.qsl.net/g3zyy/key%20top.jpg (71k file) http://www.qsl.net/g3zyy/key%20open.jpg (70k file) Whilst I'm at it; how about a 'Spot the K2' contest.. Here's my entry http://www.qsl.net/g3zyy/shack.jpg (122k file) the XYL, G4KYY (probably sensibly) refuses to go inside !! Trev G3ZYY ++++++++++++++++ From: "73 de M3MPH" To: "'Daniel Reynolds'" , "'Wallace, Andy'" , Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 17:19:51 +0100 Yes, it's a Navy key, but American not UK. The "CMI" indicates it was made by the "Moulded Insulator company" "CJB" was made by "JH Bunnell". "CTE" was by Telephonics. "CMK" by McElroy The designation of "Flameproof" in because the contacts cannot ignite vapours around it as the keys are enclosed! It's a copy of an earlier Luftwaffe key. Would have been mounted on a piece of hardwood, made as late as the 1960's too. 73 Rgds r +++++++++++++++ Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 12:56:15 -0400 From: Buddy Brannan To: elecraft at mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Reply-To: Buddy Brannan On Wed, May 28, 2003 at 08:57:02AM -0700, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: > As someone else pointed out, a key is so PERSONAL a choice, that they can't > help but raise up passions about which is "best". All true. Still, this has been lots of fun! I had an old key of some sort--gave it to a friend--that was my first. Then someone gave me one of those Nye keys...the one with the square base and the pre-wired (and connected) cable with 1/" plug and the navy knob. (I really, really liked this key a *lot*...nice feel, very comfortable.) Unfortunately, it went with an ex-girlfriend who was studying for a ham license, and I haven't got it anymore. Now, I have an old J-45; unfortunately, I've lost the original cable that came with it...looked like the original WW2 cable. From Fair Radio I got it for $20 several years ago. It's a nifty key...although the leg clamp isn't terribly comfortable. Maybe I'll get one of those Junker keys from Marshall. Haven't decided. Anyway, I'm a bit out of practice with the ol' hand key and need to get back in the swing of things again. Differing opinions or no, as subjective as the whole key discussion is, it's sure been fun! -- Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV/3 | "And if the ground yawned, Phone: (814) 455-7333 | I'd step to the side and say, Email: davros at ycardz.com | "Hey ground! I'm nobody's lunch!" http://www.ycardz.com/ | --Eddie From Ohio +++++++++++++++++ Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 10:58:31 -0700 From: Bob Nielsen To: elecraft at mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) I have an LTA combo straight key/paddle from Morse Technologies. I think the paddle has a bit too light of a feel (even with the spring at its maximum setting) but love the feel of the straight key. LTA also makes standalone straight keys . 73, Bob, N7XY ++++++++++++++++ Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 12:49:27 -0700 From: Phil Wheeler Organization: Outstanding To: Trev at secornwall.com Cc: elecraft at mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Trevor Day wrote: > Whilst on the subject of old straight keys, my straight key is German > and, I think, WW2 vintage. I'll post a couple of pics and would be > interested to hear from anyone who recognises it. (Even if its just to > translate the German text) > http://www.qsl.net/g3zyy/key%20top.jpg (71k file) > http://www.qsl.net/g3zyy/key%20open.jpg (70k file) > > Whilst I'm at it; how about a 'Spot the K2' contest.. Here's my entry No Chance . Straight Keys: I have an old WWII Navy(?) key that I bought in 1953; silver plated and the label on the armature is "C.L.T. 26001-B". Still my favorite. But I lost track of it for a few years (turned up in the broom closet!), So I bought others. One is a Nye from Morse Express with really heavy contacts, a very nice key. Also have the Kent key with ball bearings -- nice, but not very portable. Then I have a few tiny ones. And I have one of the enclosed (British?) WWII keys. Mostly nowadays I use paddles (took me 10 or so years to get the hang of them). 73, Phil ++++++++++++++++ From: "Don Wilhelm" To: Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight keyrecommendation? :) Date: Wed, 28 May 2003 22:21:50 -0400 My favorite is the Brown Brothers straight key (no longer manufactured) because it has no sideplay - it uses a wide flexible metal strap for the hinge. My next favorite is the old J-38 that I used as a novice. I cleaned it up and had the movable arm re-plated about 4 years ago - it is still in use on its new walnut base - the original disappeared many years ago. 73, Don W3FPR ----- Original Message ----- > I agree! J-38 for 50+ years. > ++++++++++++++++ From: "Kevin B. G. Luxford" To: "'Phil Wheeler'" , Cc: Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 20:02:17 +1000 Hi Trevor, In case no-one else has replied to you, you have one of those fabulous Junker keys. Junker was a German naval officer in both WWI and WWII. The engineering in these keys is superb - although they do not look particularly pretty. I have one and apart from the American style sending it assumes (arm resting on the bench and key knob close to the bench - I prefer the British style with the arm in free space) it is my favourite key. Regards, Kevin VK3DAP / ZL2DAP "homo non potest diu vivere sine aliqua delectatione sensibili" mailto:kevinluxford at optusnet.com.au Home page: http://www.qsl.net/vk3dap ++++++++++++++++ From: "Gil Stacy" To: BobDobson at aol.com, aa0ni at yahoo.com, awallace at mc.com, elecraft at mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 09:03:52 -0500 Different strokes for different folks. I never could use my J-38 as well as my Flameproof; the Flameproof seemed to operate better in my fist. In learning to send, the knob helped me control things a little better. From what I understand, there was a wide range of quality in the J-38 and maybe my J-38 wasn't up to par. Joe Jacobs offers for sale new in the box Flameproofs, mfg'd circa 1950. He is a retired employee of Bunnell and his son is the current owner of the company. Bunnell sold Flameproofs until the mid 1980s to the Mexican railroads who still used telegraphy. He has a few Flameproofs left for $69 and they come factory sealed in muslin/copper foil pouches or in corrugated boxes. He has some other keys as well and in addition to the Flameproof, I bought a fine German WWII Maus (mouse) key from him. His email address is joekey%aol.com (replace % with.). With the purchase, he sends an 11 page photocopy of the original machine drawings and specs for the govt. contract. Maybe someone can make a key from scratch. ;) My former FISTS code buddy N2KZ uses the same Flameproof his father and uncle used on the air in the late 1930s. You won't wear it out. 73 de Gil KG4VCG K2 #3104 +++++++++++++++++ From: "Leo Starrenburg PA5LS" To: "Elecraft Reflector" Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 20:47:57 +0200 Subject: [Elecraft] Re: Junker key Hi Kevin, Elecrafters, I learned to send Morsecode on a Junker and took my test on a -government issue- Junker. Since then I bought another one and although these three keys look the same and are of the same brand and type, they are very distinctive and different in "feel". I allways send with the key near the end of the table-top, and my elbow in mid-air. Lately I use a Kent key for my K2 and a small oval based key for my K1. This last key is a coveted present from Ron AC7AC and it is a perfect companion for the K1. 73' Leo PA5LS ++++++++++++++++ Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 22:29:36 -0700 To: elecraft at mailman.qth.net From: Jeff McLeman Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Re: Now how 'bout a good straight key recommendation? :) I have this key, too (two in fact). It is the key I use with my NorCAL40A, when I use that rig. I am pretty sure it is made from white metal. I had three, but one dropped and it sure didn't look like cast iron :). It broke pretty easily. Anyway, it is a great key. Oh and once in a while I'll hook it to the K2 for fun. Jeff >I have that "Navy key" (and I'm NOT a collector). A very nice OM/Elmer here in >the US gave it to me about the time I was graduating from High School. It's >built like a tank with it's cast iron design. I believe he got it from another >OM who was in WWII. >It is one piece I don't think I would ever depart with. It is very >easy to hold >with it's contoured knob. It doesn't travel with my K2, but it will definately >be QRV on SKN (Dec 31). >I'm glad to see someone else knows more about this key. >Thanks and 73, >Daniel/AA0NI +++++++++++++