Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:51:30 +0100 From: david.reid at philips.com Subject: RE:[Elecraft] K1 low output Steve, I had this apparent problem - turned out that after adjusting the right-most core the power suddenly jumped up to about 2 watts - then I was able to tweak the other cores to get a good reading. might be worth trying for yourself. Dave PA3HBB / G0BZF Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:51:39 EST From: SJWHITTON at aol.com Subject: [Elecraft] K1 low output I am in the process of doing the Alignment and Test, Part 2 My problem is that I can only get about 350 mw out of the transmitter with the inductors on the filter board tweaked, increasing the output via the menu has no affect. I can hear the transmitter on my main rig and the tone sounds good, but I must have a problem in the drive or PA . I have checked for correct component placement and all solder joints but no help. If anyone else has had the same or similar problem I would like to hear about it. The receiver works great! I am reading output on a analog wattmeter, so the problem is not in the RF detector. Thanks K9IS Steve Whitton - ---+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 08:27:28 -0600 From: Bob/WB0AUQ Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K1 low output I also thought the receiver was hot, very low output on 30m. So, I connected an ac-voltmeter across the speaker leads, tuned in a signal, and tweaked all three inductors for peak reading (made several passes thru them). Receiver really came alive and had output of 6w. It took very little final tweaking to peak the output power to 7w. Maybe worth a try...worked for me. Bob/WB0AUQ K1#373 SJWHITTON at aol.com wrote: > > I am in the process of doing the Alignment and Test, Part 2 My problem is > that I can only get about 350 mw out of the transmitter with the inductors on > the filter board tweaked...... - ---++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:47:21 +0000 From: "J. Ellis" Subject: [Elecraft] low out K-1/mpu chip Hi Folks Gary, thanks for your help, problem was not the mpu chip as I had "diagnosed" . Instead the inductors were not peaked properly and if I had just taken extra time trying to tune them carefully, I never would have had the problem. But I "assumed" they were close enough. And that's where I get into trouble - when I assume. For the benefit of those that also might be having some trouble with low output, you may find the receiver works great, and since the same circuitry is used for TX, that the TX should work fine too. Not necessarily. The inductors need to be carefully peaked to get good TX output. They are quite sharp. You would think that someone who had been building stuff for as long as I have, would know better.... (more assuming) :-) 73, John, NP2B +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 06:31:49 -0500 From: Mike Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K1 power problem Michael Bower wrote: > Has anybody got any ideas on this one? Yes, several have seen this. > When I got into MENU then Out, I can set the power to whatever. Let's > say "2.0" watts. The manual says when I got into TUNE mode, I should > see "P2.0" on the display. I ALWAYS see "P0.1" on the display Mike, you didn't say how far you'd progressed into the manual chapter 9 alignment and test procedures. This sounds *exactly* like you've NOT yet properly adjusted the filter board slug tuned coils (Band 1 L1/L2/L5/L6, Band 2 L3/L4/L7/L8) during the transmitter alignment (manual section 9). The tuning of these coils for TRANSMIT ALIGNMENT is pretty critical. Even though you peaked these coils in the earlier receiver alignment, you will ALWAYS find that they are NOT peaked sufficiently for transmit. Thus, there will usually be NO output at the start of the transmitter alignment until you've played around with the coils enough to find a peak (indicated by a maximum reading on the power-out display). I'd suggest re-performing exactly as specified the Chapter 9 alignment and test. 73, Mike / KK5F +++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 14:05:44 -0400 From: "Morrow, Michael A." Subject: [Elecraft] Making K1 Alignment TOO Complicated (long) "Jerry Ford" wrote: > I have a TS-50 here that I can play into a load and > create a signal but that just wouldn't be sporting. Hi Jerry, I'm puzzled by this. The TS-50 or other similar transceiver with accurate digital frequency display makes a very good signal source for aligning the K1. Some advantages are: (1) Good frequency accuracy (You'll need that when you calibrate the K1 display to show the K1 transmitted frequency.) (2) Good strong source of signal for the early stages of aligning the filter board coils L1 to L8. > I am on a quest to build everything it takes to put my > K-1 together and set it up. You already have *everything* you'll need with TS-50S. > I can use it to check the freq. of your noise generator > and use that to align the K-1 but I haven't been into > the DD-1 yet and not sure what it is going to take to > line it up. > > ... will it work to align receiver and VFO? Beware of making the K1 alignment process too complicated by trying to make it too sophisticated. The K1 (in contrast to the K2) is VERY simple to optimally align, as long as one follows exactly the process described in the manual. No sophisticated tools are required in order to properly adjust the K1 filter board coils. The K1 manual does NOT refer to the use of noise generators or Spectrogram for any of the alignment process, for very good reason. They're completely unnecessary. In fact, use of these may actually result in improper alignment of the K1 unless the alignment process is well understood. The proper alignment of the K1 filter board coils L1 to L8 can be summarized as follows: (1) Attempt to peak the coils on received noise. This may not be effective, since you have four coils to adjust for each band, and you may not hear much noise change until all four slugs are "close" to where they need to be. (2) On a known frequency (try about 50 kHz above bottom of the band) send a strong enough external signal (i.e., from the TS-50) that can be tuned in on the as-yet-not-properly-peaked K1. (3) Peak the coils for maximum signal, reducing the strength of the external signal as you refine the adjustments. Use of the "calibrated ear" is a completely satisfactory test instrument here, since these adjustments of L1 to L8 will NOT be the final adjustments to be made to them. All you've done at this point is get L1 through L8 within the "ballpark" of their final setting. (4) When you get to the chapter 9 alignment and test for the transmitter, re-peak L1 through L8 for maximum power output *exactly* as described in the manual. What you will find is that the peak adjustments of L1 through L8 that were performed earlier during the receiver alignment are NOT (I say again, NOT) the same as will be required for the transmitter alignment. In fact, you may find that you have little or no transmitter output at the beginning of the transmitter alignment until you start re-adjusting these coils. The *really* *really* critical adjustments of L1 through L8 take place during the *transmitter* alignment, where the final optimal adjustment of these coils will be that which results in the highest indicated output power. Also, some of these adjustments are very sharp, so one should go slowly with the slug tuning so you don't miss the peak. You *could* use the most sophisticated noise and sweep generators, computer software and spectrum analyzers, to adjust L1 through L8 on receive. It'll ALL BE A GROSS WASTE OF EFFORT since your painstakingly precise adjustments of these coils for the receive alignment will ALL be changed when you re-adjust these same coils to optimum (peak) transmitter power output. This trail has been blazed before. Trust me, Elecraft knew what they were doing when they wrote the alignment procedures for the K1. Simple IS best. 73, Mike / KK5F ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 19:47:13 -0500 From: "Andy Anderson" Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K1 power problem Michael, I had a similar problem with the power out. What it turned out to be was that I had not aligned the TX EXACTLY as in the instruction manual. Instead, since I'd aligned the RX section to perfection with Spectrogram, no way I was going to touch those things again and mess everything up. If you align the TX per the manual, you should be able to see whatever you set with an external meter like the WM2. One I realigned to the best pos for the TX, it worked like a charm...just as advertised. Wonder if you thought of this? Andy W5VCJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Bower" To: Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2001 10:43 PM Subject: [Elecraft] K1 power problem > Has anybody got any ideas on this one? > > Power up the K1, everything seems to be fine. Try keying and I get a > blank LCD. At first I thought it was kicking the radio off the air and > then coming back when I let up on the key. (LCD comes back.) But I see > in the manual that when transmitting, the LCD shows a bargraph of > transmitted power. Since my problem may be power setting too low, I'm > assuming the LCD is reading correct here. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 22:57:38 -0600 From: Andrew Madsen Subject: [Elecraft] K1 displayed power problem I recently installed the KAT1 (within the last few weeks). Tonight I noticed that if I put the rig on 40M using my 40M dipole, with the OUT menu entry set to 5 watts, the bargraph only shows 3 W in TX. If I put the rig in CALP mode, I see 5. The ATU shows a 1.3:1 SWR. On 20 M with my 20M dipoles, I get 3W out with the rig set for 5W, with or without the ATU tuning the antenna (which it won't do, as it already shows 1:1). Also, the OUT menu entry "magically" sets itself to between 3 and 3.5 sometimes, without me touching it. If I put the rig in CALP mode on 20M, I see 3.5 W out, and the power doesn't change when I press WPM+ and - -. I was able to get full power out on both 40 and 20 before I installed the ATU. I have been running version 1.09 FW since shortly after I got my K1, so that did not change when I installed the ATU. Also, I didn't notice the problem until tonight, and I actually seem to remember it working normally earlier today. Any suggestions? - -- 73, Andrew R. Madsen AC7CF ac7cf at youngradioamateurs.com http://www.youngradioamateurs.com/ League of Young Radio Amateurs Utah Section Manager Technology Committee Chairman CW/QRP Committee Co-Chairman +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 06:52:43 EDT From: K4ZM at aol.com Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K1 displayed power problem Where are you reading the output power, on the K1 display or on a wattmeter connected to the output of the rig? If your reading it external of the rig then you are connecting the wattmeter before the antenna tuner and it is not going to read accurately because the impedance at that point is something other than 50 ohms. The only way you could read it accurately with an external meter is to connect the wattmeter between the input to the antenna tuner and the output of the K1 rf amp. This is difficult to do in the K1. The reason you are reading it accurately in the Cal P is because the tuner is switched out in that mode. 73 Jim Younce K4ZM K2 SN:18 K2 Field Tester ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 08:02:14 -0600 From: Andrew Madsen Subject: [Elecraft] Re: K1 displayed power problem I shouldn't have worked on this so late. The lower power output was because I was using 8 AA NiMH batteries as a power source. As soon as I switch to a 13.8 V supply, the power comes up, and the radio acts normally. 73, Andrew AC7CF Andrew Madsen wrote: > I recently installed the KAT1 (within the last few weeks). Tonight I > noticed that if I put the rig on 40M using my 40M dipole, with the OUT > menu entry set to 5 watts, the bargraph only shows 3 W in TX. If I put > the rig in CALP mode, I see 5. The ATU shows a 1.3:1 SWR. On 20 M with > my 20M dipoles, I get 3W out with the rig set for 5W, with or without > the ATU tuning the antenna (which it won't do, as it already shows > 1:1). Also, the OUT menu entry "magically" sets itself to between 3 and > 3.5 sometimes, without me touching it. If I put the rig in CALP mode on > 20M, I see 3.5 W out, and the power doesn't change when I press WPM+ and > -. I was able to get full power out on both 40 and 20 before I > installed the ATU. I have been running version 1.09 FW since shortly > after I got my K1, so that did not change when I installed the ATU. > Also, I didn't notice the problem until tonight, and I actually seem to > remember it working normally earlier today. Any suggestions? > > -- > 73, > Andrew R. Madsen AC7CF > ac7cf at youngradioamateurs.com > http://www.youngradioamateurs.com/ > League of Young Radio Amateurs > Utah Section Manager > Technology Committee Chairman > CW/QRP Committee Co-Chairman ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 06:19:50 -0400 From: Michael Bower Subject: [Elecraft] It's working (was K1 power problem) K1 #720 is working like gangbusters!!! Thanks to Randy (N4TVC), K1 #720 is now up and running and pulling in stations like crazy. Took the rig over to Randy's Wednesday afternoon and within 10-15 minutes he had the problem diagnosed and solved. Of course, we stayed another 45 minutes to look at and drool on all of Randy's neat rigs, memorabilia and antenna farm. (He's one of the few lucky ones in this area without an HOA.) Thanks, Randy, for all the help and the tour. What an Elmer. Here's the lesson learned. When you align a receiver, you should use the lowest (quietest) signal that you can hear and tweak that for maximum receive. I apparently used a pretty loud signal and, therefore, didn't really align the receiver very well, although I thought I did. When Randy discovered the mis-alignment of the receiver, he re-aligned the receiver and the transmitter power came up very nicely and was almost correctly aligned as well. Again, thanks, Randy. I don't know what I or NoVaQRP would do without your experience and insights. Michael N4NMR P.S. And to all of you that sent me suggestions, thank you one and all. This hobby still amazes me at the helpfulness of everyone. Not only did I get technical suggestions, some of you recognized that I was not a "happy camper" and sent words of encouragement. Thank you all. Michael Rohn.Blake at helpsystems.com wrote: > > > When I got into MENU then Out, I can set the power to whatever. Let's > > say "2.0" watts. The manual says when I got into TUNE mode, I should > > see "P2.0" on the display. I ALWAYS see "P0.1" on the display. (Which, > > I have the somewhat exact same experience on my K2... I'm at the Alignment > and Test Part III (pg72 of rev C manual). I can't get anything but 0.1 on > the display and my wattmeter shows no signs of the K2 transmitting. > > The replies I received teetered between checking all solder joints and > signal tracing. I bet the same advice applies to the K1. > > This probably doesn't help you much with your K1... but I resoldered one > spot that under a magnifying glass looked possibly maybe sorta suspect. A > hopeful attempt, but not the source of my problem. Like you, I'm probably > facing the need to trace a signal all the way through. Given the time > likely involved, this project will probably be on my to-be-completed list > until sometime after summer (I'm on the edge of sending it in though, so I > can use it while it's still nice in MN!). > > Good luck with your K1 and I hope you problem is identified quicklier! > > 73 de Rohn, KR0HN > > --- > Submissions: elecraft at qth.net (You must be subscribed to post) > Postings must be sent from the exact same addr. as subcribed. > Please note: The list server automatically rejects HTML encoded emails. > List Archive page: http://www.qth.net/archive/elecraft/elecraft.html > Elecraft Web Page: http://www.elecraft.com - -- 73 de N4NMR Michael Bower Ashburn, VA (near Washington, D.C.) - --- Submissions: elecraft at qth.net (You must be subscribed to post) Postings must be sent from the exact same addr. as subcribed. Please note: The list server automatically rejects HTML encoded emails. List Archive page: http://www.qth.net/archive/elecraft/elecraft.html Elecraft Web Page: http://www.elecraft.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 06:52:09 -0400 From: Allen Randy Subject: [Elecraft] RE: It's working (was K1 power problem) Thanks, Michael, for the kind words. I enjoy helping folks more than building my own stuff. The highlight for me last night was explaining the SPOT function and after getting about 75% through the 'lecture' seeing the lights come on in your eyes. You correctly 'read ahead' and figured out where I was going with the explanation. That's satisfaction. Wayne knows the value of a SPOT function, even in a transceiver vs spearate Rx and Tx configurations. I think this was the first thing that drew me towards Elecraft. You did a good job on the construction and you were on the right track, all along. Also, I always enjoy showing off the shack. 73, Randy, N4TVC ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++