+++++++++++++++++ See also K2 To Build or Not To Build +++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 13:17:56 -0500 From: W2AGN Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? On Saturday 15 December 2001 12:35, Don Jones wrote: > The purpose of this post is not at all to criticize the discussion of > tinned toroid leads, construction techniques, nor pride in construction > abilities. My intent is to seek clarification as to what "easy to > construct" actually means. If it means easy for a 64 year old retired > computer techie with average visual degeneration for my age, minimal > interest in construction and maximum interest in operating (48 years of > it), I am in. If it is going to be too much for the likes of me, please > be a friend and tell me so. > > Thanks and 73 - Don N4TN - -- Don, You have to keep in mind that there are always some ready to make a mountain out of a molehill. Also, everyone wants to be thought an "expert." (We know the definition of "expert," don't we?). Yes, you have to get the crap off the enamelled wire so you can solder it, same as 48 years ago! You have about 5 years on me, but my eyes are probably crummier than yours. I have had NO trouble with toroids in the K2, K1 or any of some dozen+ other QRP rigs I have built, even before the "experts" told me how to do it. If you built Heathkits, etc., you will really enjoy building the K2. The instructions are designed for today's Ham, who took his VEC exam from his brother-in-kaw, and doesn't really know a toroid from a solenoid. So go for it! -------------------------- John L Sielke W2AGN ++++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 14:22:44 -0500 From: Dave Gingrich K9DC Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? At 12:35 12/15/2001 -0500, Don Jones wrote: >My intent is to seek clarification as to what "easy to >construct" actually means. If it means easy for a 64 year old retired >computer techie with average visual degeneration for my age, minimal >interest in construction and maximum interest in operating (48 years of >it), I am in. If it is going to be too much for the likes of me, please >be a friend and tell me so. Don- Since you built Heathkits once, you know how to solder. You won't have a problem. A good soldering iron, magnifying glass to read some of the component values, digital VOM, and a few other hand tools are all that is necessary. Don't be nervous. ================================================ Dave Gingrich, K9DC - Indianapolis, Indiana USA K2 #2211, K1 #931, QRP-L #2376, ARS #1109, FPQRP #389, CCIE #6748 +++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 13:29:32 -0600 From: "William R. Moore" Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? I highly recommend that you download the K2 manual and see for yourself how difficult it will be. It concerns me a little when you say you have minimal interest in construction. The K2 is, after all, a kit. For me, the construction process was as much pleasure as operating the rig. I took my time and double checked everything I did against the manual. I had one mechanical error during assembly and that was caused by a moment's inattention when I installed a connector on the wrong side of a board - really dumb. The manual was absolutely clear, but I just screwed up. I had no previous experience with torroids and they didn't cause me any difficulty at all. 73, Randy, KS4L K2 #337 +++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 11:44:19 -0800 From: lhlousek Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? Hi Don, Elecraft kits are not hard to build. The quality of the components and the design are top notch and that contributes a lot to the ease of construction. If you can solder one component you can solder 1000. There are a lot of parts in a K2 so it does take time to construct. From what I've seen on this list you should be able to complete it in 40 to 60 leisurely hrs. Winding and tinning toroids isn't difficult. It just takes time and a reasonable amount of care to insure the toroid leads are properly tinned before soldering them into the board. The only way to do this is to examine the tinned leads under magnification. A 3~4 power head mounted binocular magnifier, or something equivalent, is a must and really helps with all phases of assembly of the boards. The Optivisor, which sells for around $30, is among the better magnifiers available. Once you have one of these you'll use it for a lot of things. If you let your XYL borrow it you'll probably wind up getting her one of her own. Some of the small parts have very small markings and require even higher magnification to read. A 10 power magnifier or loupe will work well for this purpose. Of course, there is always the possibility of making a mistake during assembly or getting a bad component and that will necessitate troubleshooting. Should this happen, the reflector and website can be an excellent source of help. And, of course, Elecraft's technical support is the best out there. If the problem proves intractable for you or you simply don't have the time or inclination to pursue resolving it, you can send the kit into Elecraft and, for a fee, they will get it get it working for you. It isn't really necessary to enjoy the building process itself. The satisfaction and operating enjoyment that follow after having labored through the building, troubleshooting, and alignment process is more than enough reason to undertake the building the rig. If you happen to enjoy the building process too, that's just icing on the cake. Lou W7DZN ++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 14:50:28 -0700 From: "=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22D=2ER=2E_Weiss_KI=D8RP=22?=" Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? To Don: I agree with what the others have said -- this kit is very carefully organized for trouble-free building. It's not only the Rolls-Royce of QRP rigs, it's the Rolls-Royce of radio kits. The community is also unique. The reason you see such discussions and disagreements is that we're all interested in how each other builds, modifies, and operates the Elecraft radios. Everyone is willing to help -- with advice or actual hands-on construction. There's probably a K2 owner near you who will gladly come over and give any assistance necessary at any stage in the project. You won't find that kind of support for another radio. And if, in the middle of construction, you find you don't like it, you probably won't have any difficulty getting someone else to finish the kit for you, or even selling the partially-built kit. Dave Weiss KI0RP K2 #2249 +++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 16:39:13 -0600 From: Tom Hammond =?iso-8859-1?Q?N=D8SS?= Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? Hi Don: At 11:35 AM 12/15/01, you wrote: >"Elecraft is committed to making easy to construct, full-featured HF >rigs." That is a direct, cut-and-paste quote from the K2 description >page of the Elecraft web site. Yet I count at at least 17 posts >addressing the single subject of tinning leads for the toroids! There's NOTHING that (any) reflector subscribers love more than to beat a horse... first to death, and then into a bloody pulp... it's the nature of the beast, I'm afraid. >I have got to say that the amount of concern over wire tinning, the >disagreement >over how it should be done... Obviously, ensuring that the enamel-coated leads coming from your toroidal inductors are well tinned is a crucial(!) part of any building project which uses them. Virtually ALL of this type of inductor will have RF (and quite possibly DC as well) passing thru them, and if even one lead cannot be securely electrically AND mechanically connected to the prior and following components in the signal path, you've got a point where no signal will pass... resulting in a problem. There are a BUNCH of ways to remove the (heat strippable) enamel from the wire used to wind these inductors. Some ways are better than others, and some are downright poor. The 'solder blob' method was selected because it was the most repeatable method which didn't risk damage to the wire itself in the process. The only thing required for the solder blob method is a nice, hot iron, and (probably) a flat spot on the soldering iron tip (on which to melt the solder). You certainly do NOT need a solder pot. That is a bit of overkill. But any time the subject is broached on the reflector every builder has to post 'his' (better) way of doing it... So, you read 'em all, try a couple, and then choose the one YOU like best as your own. >...and the implied requirement for special soldering equipment frankly >have me very concerned. OK... here's the deal... You DO NOT have to have high-priced equipment to build a kit... ANY kit. However, having the right tools for the job will (help to) ensure that the job is done right the first time. Of course, a significant portion of building any piece of electronic gear depends solely upon the abilities of the builder... mainly the amount of effort and care put into the building itself. This part of the effort is completely independent of the equipment used. I've built a bunch of kits, and completely home-brewed projects over the years. For the first 40(!) years of my ham life, I used any soldering iron I had around when the need presented itself. In doing so, I HAD to develop a good soldering technique, mainly because there was times when I knew I was using the wrong iron for the task, but it was the only thing I had at the moment and so I had to develop a technique to allow it to do the job well. I have a local friend (who shall remain nameless... but his call is KA0OUV) who was all over me about my 'archaic' soldering irons, and the fact that I didn't have the right tool for the job MOST of the time... esp. when it came to fine PC (small pads) soldering. I was always able to fend off Tim's friendly jabs. But when I bought my first Elecraft kit, I also invested in a temp-controlled soldering station ($110 at the time) and several different tips of various tip widths, to better match the size of the PC board pads I was working on. It wasn't until I actually begin BUILDING my K2 that I realized the benefit of my choice... I found that, not only was I making cleaner solder joints, but I was not nearly as wiped out at the end of a lengthy building session as I'd been when using the other irons, even though I was younger then. The ability to actually dial-in a specific temp and know that the was going to be THAT temp when I called for it, and that the station would work to maintain that tip temp DURING the actual soldering operation really made assembly much easier for me... no kidding... I realize no monetary gain for 'hawking' soldering stations... . My soldered joints were not only, cleaner, they were also more consistently done. You don't have to spend a bundle on a temp-controlled iron... they can be bought for c. $40, with another $10 for an assortment of 3-4 tips. Of course, there are other, more costly soldering stations, but I'm not sure they offer all THAT much more utility... especially if you really only want to use it for this one project. You probably have most of the other tools required to assemble a kit. If you don't you can easily acquire them. >If purchasing a K2 means obtaining a fine rig and saving some money by >doing the kind of labor that is within my capabilites, then I am ready to >complete the online order form. If simply completing the project implies >the degree of difficulty that merits some kind of red-badge of courage and >entry into a sainted brotherhood (as a few have implied), I have a notion >that I will end up sorely frustrated and disappointed. We have a number of absolute 'newbies' in our ranks... folks who may well have never touched a PC board before building their kits. And, I suspect that many, if not all, of them still have all the hair(s) they started out with. Care, and patience are the main watchwords of building, if you ask me. >The purpose of this post is not at all to criticize the discussion of >tinned toroid leads, construction techniques, nor pride in construction >abilities. My intent is to seek clarification as to what "easy to >construct" actually means. If it means easy for a 64 year old >retired computer techie with average visual degeneration for my age, >minimal interest in construction and maximum interest in operating (48 >years of it), I am in. If it is going to be too much for the likes of me, >please be a friend and tell me so. I'm a one-eyed 57 year old who, I've been recently told, is developing a cataract on my only remaining peeper. Fortunately, I enjoy both operating (a lot) and building (almost as much as operating). For the past 30+ years, I ALWAYS use a head-mounted magnifier (Magni-Focuser, maybe x2.5 or x3, not sure, but the focal length is probably 3.5"-4.5"). This device has made it EASY for me to get my nose down to the components, so I can see what they read and where I'm supposed to be soldering... so far, I've only soldered the tip of my nose once (another sad story, certainly best left UNpublished here). Get SOMETHING that will allow you to magnify your work area... something you don't have to hold with one hand while you work with other... soldering is a 2-hand operation. If I've scared you off, I'm sorry. If I've given you new hope, then welcome to the group! Do I think you can do it... probably, but it's all up to you to decide for yourself. I'm sure you'll make the right decision. 73 - Tom Hammond N0SS PS now that I've posted this to the reflector, I suspect you should brace for a slew of dissenting, and hopefully some agreeing, comments. ++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 19:37:58 -0500 From: Don Jones Subject: Re: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? -Thanks to all!!! I can not begin to properly thank all of you for the enthusiastic words of encouragement and reassurance! You have me so pumped up now that I wish I had the kit in my shaky old hands this evening! Really, I am impressed and humbled by the support from everyone. I see no choice but to enter into immediate negotiations with Ole St. Nick and try to get my K2 kit headed this way just as fast as his fat little legs can deliver it. Until it arrives, I'll keep myself busy cleaning my glasses, clearing off a work space (a 3 day project in itself), and laying in a good soldering iron as well as replacing a few of the tools in the dilapidated old Customer Engineer's toolbag that I carried for IBM many long years ago. Oh yes - and I'll definitely be looking for a Magni-focuser. My late father kept one on his head constantly when he was busy in his woodworking shop. The kind and understanding words of all who responded (as well as the restraint of those who might have felt the urge to flame an apparent "appliance operator") are sincerely appreciated. I do believe that I have fallen in amongst a very fine bunch of amateurs. If I run into trouble, I'll know where to find you! By the way, I do have the promise of assistance from Dan, N4ROA, renowned QRPer, builder of Elecrafts, astute gentleman of the first water and my neighbor "just up the road a ways" in southwestern Virginia. Thank you all, Happy Holidays and I'll see you when the smoke clears... 73 - Don Jones N4TN Kingsport, TN +++++++++++++++++++ Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2001 10:31:45 +0000 From: "Julian, G4ILO" Subject: [Elecraft] How easy is easy? Don, Building a K2 is easy considering the complexity of the design. That doesn't mean to say it shouldn't present the builder with some interesting challenges. When I got my K2 I had only just got back into ham radio again after a gap of several years. I hadn't built anything of any significance for a long time, so whatever constructional skills I may once have had were pretty rusty. I'm 48, so my eyesight isn't as sharp as it was, either. I had no special tools or equipment. Even the soldering iron I used was bought over 30 years ago when I was a teenager and spent much more time playing with electronics. As was the solder! I didn't buy any special tools for the K2 because I wouldn't have made much use of them once the K2 was finished and I don't have money to spend on things I won't use. If you can afford them, they will probably make the job easier, but I managed without them just fine. The only special skills I brought to building my K2 were patience, care and time. I never worked late, or when I was tired. I did short stints of a couple of hours or so. I double and triple checked my component placements. I inspected all soldered joints with a magnifying glass. If there was any doubt whether it was soldered properly, I did it again. The only problem I had with my kit was bad luck, due to an O/C feedback choke in the predriver. I think I am the only builder ever to have had that problem, but the assistance provided here and by Elecraft helped sort that out. If I can build a K2, anyone can! 73, - -- Julian, G4ILO. (RSGB, ARRL, K2 #392) Homepage: http://www.qsl.net/g4ilo ++++++++++++++++++=