From kc5goi@kc5goi.ampr.org Sat Feb 01 12:39:42 1997 Received: from KC5GOI (kc5goi.ampr.org [44.28.0.201]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id MAA19859 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 12:39:06 -0600 (CST) Date: Sat, 01 Feb 97 12:40:17 cst Message-Id: <223@kc5goi.ampr.org> From: kc5goi@kc5goi.ampr.org (guy j story) Reply-To: kc5goi@kc5goi.ampr.org To: ss@tapr.org Subject: RE: The point of the SS group buy(Tony Lanier) Lines: 24 X-Mailer: PCElm 3.01 In reference to Tony's post, I have to agree. I have been thinking about the purchase of a 9600 baud tnc lately but decided not to in favor of the SS project. 1200 baud is a joke but 9600 in not much better. Newer ways of sending data, voice and so on are needed. I was looking forward to the FW radio and was disappointed in the project falling out. I am in favor of a kit that a person would build due to the learning aspect and the pride of saying I built it. I am one a the hams that does not have a great deal of technical background or finacial resources. Because of this I feel that this makes me a good test bed as the "average joe ham". If I can make it work so can anyone else. The brick wall people run up against is that this is new and I dont understand. There for some will not even consider it. That is why some people still embrace tube gear as "Gods gift to the hobby". A kit will give hands on experience. The FW radio was a quick way to get up and running. We need to get the show on the road before the STA expires. That is on of the impressions I got for using the FW. That still is an avenue we need to pursue. But we also need to consider long term goals. ================================= = 73, KC5GOI = = Denton, Tx USA = = email:kc5goi@kc5goi.ampr.org = ================================= From jeff@mich.com Sat Feb 01 16:02:19 1997 Received: from server1.mich.com (root@server1.mich.com [198.108.16.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id QAA27711; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 16:02:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from gw-aerodata.mich.com (gw-aerodata.mich.com [198.108.16.240]) by server1.mich.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id RAA25567; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 17:02:48 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970201220206.006be430@mail.mich.com> X-Sender: jeff@mail.mich.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 01 Feb 1997 17:02:06 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org, ss-sta@tapr.org From: Jeff King Subject: What next? (was Re: Point(Tony Lanier)) Cc: kc5goi@kc5goi.ampr.org At 12:45 PM 2/1/97 -0600, guy j story wrote: >I was looking forward to the FW radio >and was disappointed in the project falling out. I am in favor of a kit that >a person would build due to the learning aspect and the pride of saying I >built it. A Eval board is basically a kit. Sorta of akin to a TAPR Alpha/Beta board TNC. It would create a new wave of innovation within the amateur community. BTW, Randy Roberts has also offered a "ham hopper" design to the amateur community... but not sure if it is operational yet. >The FW radio was a quick way to get up and running. >We need to get the show on the road before the STA expires. That is on >of the impressions I got for using the FW. That still is an avenue we >need to pursue. But we also need to consider long term goals. > > > >================================= >= 73, KC5GOI = But the FreeWave was a decent radio.... I'm not so sure what I am hearing being discussed will even hold a candle to the FreeWave. For example, both radios mentioned are 2.4ghz units.... most hams were going to be frequency challenged at 900mhz let alone at 2.5ghz. I'm not saying I'm against 2.5ghz development, I just want folks to be aware we are talking two different animimals. Also, both 2.5ghz radios mentioned are 100mw units, that and the reduction in sensitivity on both 2.5ghz units give the FreeWave a 30db advantage. Also add in the fact it was a lower cost radio and you come up with the same answer I did.... maybe we need to think about what direction we are going before we leap. However, my primary concern is having a development path that a proprietary solution wouldn't give us. -Jeff From wd5ivd@tapr.org Sat Feb 01 16:06:43 1997 Received: from [208.134.134.40] ([208.134.134.40]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id QAA28090 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 16:06:40 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 1 Feb 1997 16:13:55 -0600 To: " Spread Spectrum " From: "Greg Jones, WD5IVD" Subject: Any TAPR Group Purchase There has been some discussion on the list about how TAPR does group purchases. Let me outline the unofficial policy. Basically, if someone can show something that is of interest to a critical mass of people such that it helps the membership of TAPR for TAPR to handle the ordering then the project will be considered by TAPR to be done. Examples have been the PC-DSP purchase just completed, the EVM56002 DSP units (which Dorothy is shipping the last of) and the Garmin GPS-20s. The issue that gets most potential purchases is that the markup of TAPR's overhead (Visa expense, shipping, office time, general overhead) has to be factored into the price of which the item can be handled by TAPR and provided to people for purchase. Many times, potential group deals do not gell, because the final price with overhead is not a significant enough savings for a group purchase to happen. We would be willing to entertain any of the notions or projects people have in mind, but has any of you looked at the pricing of the eval units that the mfg are offering. I know the Harris set costs around $3000+ to get all the various elements to make a working system. The loral SS eval board (which has no RF) costs about $2500 to get. I think we will find that any of these approaches will be cost limited. If someone has a concept for a project, we are all ears. We have already had two projects discussed very informally for TAPR to do. Both have been very speculative in nature and we are waiting to see if either will have anything done beyond just some basic thoughts. Talking about doing something is one thing, but doing it and following through the entire process is more than many realize the level of commitment. Cheers - Greg ----- Greg Jones, WD5IVD Austin, Texas wd5ivd@tapr.org http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd ----- From clearbrook_technical@mindlink.bc.ca Sat Feb 01 19:10:18 1997 Received: from linux.clrtech.com. (excel54.jumppoint.com [204.191.232.179]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id TAA07690 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 19:10:14 -0600 (CST) Received: from fk-win.mtn.clrtech.com (fk-win.mtn.clrtech.com [172.17.100.103]) by linux.clrtech.com. (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id SAA13911 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 18:16:17 -0800 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 1997 18:16:17 -0800 Message-Id: <199702020216.SAA13911@linux.clrtech.com.> X-Sender: clearbrook_technical@linux.clrtech.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: Clearbrook Technical Subject: Re: [SS:931] Re: WaveLAN Performance (Was: *nix on floppy) >> Within my house I consistently get 190 kbyte/second ftp transfer speeds >> when transfering large files and there are only two stations active. > >That's impressive. I tried the WaveLAN packet driver and JNOS, and >only got about 70 kbytes/s. This was with the TCP window equal to >the MSS - if I opened up the window to a multiple of MSS, the >throughput nosedived to near-zero. I got the impression that JNOS >wasn't keeping the pipe filled, so carrier would drop briefly >between outgoing segments, causing the receiving end to ACK and >collide with the next segment. Or maybe WaveLAN is doing something >strange at the link layer which interacts badly with the upper layers, >or maybe the packet driver is just plain broken. Anybody got a handle >on that? > >Barry > I had similiar experience with my jnos configuration, I had to keep the tcp win to a maximum of double the MSS, any higher than that, and the thruput would suffer greatly. When i switched to linux I was impressed with the improvement I run the TCP Window open (linux default) and thruput regularily is around 1.5Mbits showing on the IPswitch FTP client (on Win 95 PC). The link always feels much 'smoother' using the linux configuration over the jnos..... > Fred Kehler (ve7ipb) Clearbrook Technical Services Ltd From randyrf@sss-mag.com Sat Feb 01 19:31:29 1997 Received: from nanospace.com (root@nanos1.nanospace.com [205.199.199.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id TAA08817 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 19:31:27 -0600 (CST) Received: from pa01-07.nanospace.com ([205.199.196.107]) by nanospace.com with smtp id (Smail3.1.29.1); Sat, 1 Feb 97 17:31 PST Date: Sat, 1 Feb 97 17:31 PST Message-Id: <2.2.16.19970202093039.517fbce2@sss-mag.com> X-Sender: randyrf@sss-mag.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) To: ss@tapr.org From: Randy Roberts Subject: Re: [SS:958] Any TAPR Group Purchase OK folks, here goes -- ACTION, not talk! KC6YJY's Proposed SST-1 SS Radio-Modem for Ham Radio Applications Here's my proposal: I (and RF/SS) will grant a THREE YEAR NON-EXCLUSIVE LICENSE to TAPR [or any other Bona Fide Amateur Radio Organization], at NO COST WHATSOEVER, which includes a relatively complete design and documentation package for a "Universal," DSSS / FHSS / Hybrid FH-DS radio-modem with the following initial design characteristics and specifications preliminarily outlined below). This licensed design package will allow the user to rapidly assemble the pieces needed to offer either kits or completed products to the Amateur Radio Community. These kits can be modular in capability and can be designed with expansion in mind. The performance of this licensed design is State of the Art in every way. It uses the latest in ASIC technology and provides better than commercial WLAN SS communications, that rival what the US military are using today! PROVIDED: (1) The radio-modem is used ONLY for Amateur / non-commercial or to-be-negotiated educational uses. (2) TAPR (or any other Bona Fide Amateur Radio Organization) and other assorted / interested volunteers supply labor and materials, as needed, to fully develop and test this new design. (3) TAPR (or any other Bona Fide Amateur Radio Organization) sets up a Project / Team organization to provide direction, guidance and start on a "Ham Radio SS" Standard, ASAP! (4) The draft standard mentioned in (3) above is ready for circulation and comment by 1 May, 1997 AND that the Final Interium Standard for Ham SS operations is released by 1 August, 1997. PROPOSED RF/SS SST-1 RADIO-MODEM SPECIFICATIONS: - Half duplex on the air communications - TX - RX & RX - TX Switching Times: 500 microseconds, design goal - Frequency Range: 24 to 34 MHz (TO BE USED with an OUTBOARD LINEAR TRANSVERTER for operating frequency band.) - TX output Power: > +13 dBm (20mw) average - RX NF: < 3 dB - SS Mode Capability: DSSS, FHSS, Hybrid FH-SS - Process Gain: 10 to 18 dB with DSSS / up to 30 dB with FHSS / > 40 dB with Hybrid FH-SS - DSSS Chipset: STEL-2000A (same as Zilog Z87200) - FHSS Chip set: Analog Devices AD9955 (Fast option) / AD7008 (Slow option) - "SMART" Radio Setup & Control: PIC 16C64A - HOST I/O: slow speed = RS-232 / high speed = Synchronous Serial (SIO) port (HDLC-like) -- both I/O speeds use Tx / RX handshaking - Data Rates: 1 bps to >250 kbps - Master Clock: 80 MHz TCXO, freq. stability , +/- 10 ppm - Frequency Hopping Speed: 1 microsecond maximum, design goal - PN Codes: Fully Programmable in length and selection - FH Codes: Fully Programmable in length and selection - Multiple Access Capability: Fully Programmable / User selectable - Baseband Data Protocols: TBD / TBS - HOST / TNC Characteristics: To Be Developed - OSI Communication Modes / Level Definition: To Be Developed - Applications / Application Software: To Be Developed - Physical: Two PCBs - each about 3" x 5" (TWO sided), design goal (See Baseband PCB Breadboard at top of page) - POWER Required: + 11 to 14 VDC at less than 1 amp - Other Characteristics: TBD / TBS PLEASE take a look at actual test results and breadboard pictures at my home page: http://sss-mag.com/hamnotes.html Hope TAPR or some of you out there are interested. TNX & 73 de Randy Roberts, KC6YJY -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- At 04:14 PM 2/1/97 -0600, you wrote: >There has been some discussion on the list about how TAPR does group purchases. > >Let me outline the unofficial policy. > >Basically, if someone can show something that is of interest to a critical >mass of people such that it helps the membership of TAPR for TAPR to handle >the ordering then the project will be considered by TAPR to be done. > >Examples have been the PC-DSP purchase just completed, the EVM56002 DSP >units (which Dorothy is shipping the last of) and the Garmin GPS-20s. > >The issue that gets most potential purchases is that the markup of TAPR's >overhead (Visa expense, shipping, office time, general overhead) has to be >factored into the price of which the item can be handled by TAPR and >provided to people for purchase. Many times, potential group deals do not >gell, because the final price with overhead is not a significant enough >savings for a group purchase to happen. > >We would be willing to entertain any of the notions or projects people have >in mind, but has any of you looked at the pricing of the eval units that >the mfg are offering. I know the Harris set costs around $3000+ to get all >the various elements to make a working system. The loral SS eval board >(which has no RF) costs about $2500 to get. I think we will find that any >of these approaches will be cost limited. > >If someone has a concept for a project, we are all ears. We have already >had two projects discussed very informally for TAPR to do. Both have been >very speculative in nature and we are waiting to see if either will have >anything done beyond just some basic thoughts. > >Talking about doing something is one thing, but doing it and following >through the entire process is more than many realize the level of >commitment. > >Cheers - Greg > >----- >Greg Jones, WD5IVD >Austin, Texas >wd5ivd@tapr.org >http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd >----- From jerryn@ici.net Sat Feb 01 21:22:13 1997 Received: from uhura.ici.net (uhura.ici.net [204.97.252.6]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id VAA15170 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 21:22:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from nomad (d-ma-fallriver-75.ici.net [207.180.10.84]) by uhura.ici.net (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id WAA04738 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 22:18:24 -0500 (EST) Sender: root@uhura.ici.net Message-ID: <32F40640.26E6236E@ici.net> Date: Sat, 01 Feb 1997 22:13:04 -0500 From: Jerry Normandin X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.26 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:959] Re: WaveLAN Performance (Was: *nix on floppy) References: <199702020216.SAA13911@linux.clrtech.com.> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Clearbrook Technical wrote: > > >> Within my house I consistently get 190 kbyte/second ftp transfer speeds > >> when transfering large files and there are only two stations active. > > > >That's impressive. I tried the WaveLAN packet driver and JNOS, and > >only got about 70 kbytes/s. This was with the TCP window equal to Gee Guys, This is what I have been claiming all along and NOT MANY BELIEVED ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LINUX is the way to go, and it's very effecient as a wireless router! NO MORE DIGIPEATING IT IS NOT NECCESARY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! THIS WILL BEHAVE THE SAME WAY AS AN ETHERNET ROUTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > >the MSS - if I opened up the window to a multiple of MSS, the > >throughput nosedived to near-zero. I got the impression that JNOS > >wasn't keeping the pipe filled, so carrier would drop briefly > >between outgoing segments, causing the receiving end to ACK and > >collide with the next segment. Or maybe WaveLAN is doing something > >strange at the link layer which interacts badly with the upper layers, > >or maybe the packet driver is just plain broken. Anybody got a handle > >on that? > > > >Barry > > > I had similiar experience with my jnos configuration, I had to keep the tcp win > to a maximum of double the MSS, any higher than that, and the thruput would > suffer greatly. When i switched to linux I was impressed with the improvement > I run the TCP Window open (linux default) and thruput regularily is around > 1.5Mbits showing on the IPswitch FTP client (on Win 95 PC). The link always > feels much 'smoother' using the linux configuration over the jnos..... > > > > > Fred Kehler (ve7ipb) > Clearbrook Technical Services Ltd From arutz@shfmicro.com Sat Feb 01 21:24:32 1997 Received: from alice.adsnet.com (adsnet.com [206.158.2.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA15254 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 21:24:30 -0600 (CST) Received: from pool-001-53.adsnet.com (pool-001-53.adsnet.com [208.4.86.53]) by alice.adsnet.com (8.6.5/8.6.6) with SMTP id VAA10740 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 21:28:35 -0600 Date: Sat, 1 Feb 1997 21:28:35 -0600 Message-Id: <199702020328.VAA10740@alice.adsnet.com> X-Sender: arutz@mail.adsnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: arutz@shfmicro.com (alan rutz) Subject: Re: [SS:960] Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase As a charter subscriber to Randy's Spread-spectrum magazine back in 1991-92, I have always thought his designs, writing, and news on the RF designs for ss have been ahead of anything else I could find. I certainly think the offer he has made deserves attention. If his offer follows plans printed early-on in his publications, it is probably easy to understand and to build. de alan, wa9gka From jerryn@ici.net Sat Feb 01 21:31:12 1997 Received: from uhura.ici.net (uhura.ici.net [204.97.252.6]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id VAA15452 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 21:31:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from nomad (d-ma-fallriver-75.ici.net [207.180.10.84]) by uhura.ici.net (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id WAA05661 for ; Sat, 1 Feb 1997 22:27:18 -0500 (EST) Sender: root@uhura.ici.net Message-ID: <32F40856.AEB2048@ici.net> Date: Sat, 01 Feb 1997 22:21:58 -0500 From: Jerry Normandin X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.26 i486) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:960] Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase References: <2.2.16.19970202093039.517fbce2@sss-mag.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Randy Roberts wrote: > > OK folks, here goes -- ACTION, not talk! > > KC6YJY's Proposed SST-1 SS Radio-Modem for > Ham Radio Applications > > Here's my proposal: > > I (and RF/SS) will grant a THREE YEAR NON-EXCLUSIVE LICENSE > to TAPR [or any other Bona Fide Amateur Radio Organization], at > NO COST WHATSOEVER, which includes a relatively complete > design and documentation package for a "Universal," DSSS / FHSS > / Hybrid FH-DS radio-modem with the following initial design > characteristics and specifications preliminarily outlined below). > > This licensed design package will allow the user to rapidly assemble > the pieces needed to offer either kits or completed products to the > Amateur Radio Community. These kits can be modular in capability > and can be designed with expansion in mind. The performance of this > licensed design is State of the Art in every way. It uses the latest in > ASIC technology and provides better than commercial WLAN SS > communications, that rival what the US military are using today! > > PROVIDED: > > (1) The radio-modem is used ONLY for Amateur / non-commercial or > to-be-negotiated educational uses. > > (2) TAPR (or any other Bona Fide Amateur Radio Organization) and > other assorted / interested volunteers supply labor and materials, > as needed, to fully develop and test this new design. > > (3) TAPR (or any other Bona Fide Amateur Radio Organization) sets > up a Project / Team organization to provide direction, guidance and > start on a "Ham Radio SS" Standard, ASAP! > > (4) The draft standard mentioned in (3) above is ready for circulation > and comment by 1 May, 1997 AND that the Final Interium Standard > for Ham SS operations is released by 1 August, 1997. > > PROPOSED RF/SS SST-1 RADIO-MODEM SPECIFICATIONS: > > - Half duplex on the air communications > > - TX - RX & RX - TX Switching Times: 500 microseconds, design goal > > - Frequency Range: 24 to 34 MHz (TO BE USED with an OUTBOARD > LINEAR TRANSVERTER for operating frequency band.) > > - TX output Power: > +13 dBm (20mw) average > > - RX NF: < 3 dB > > - SS Mode Capability: DSSS, FHSS, Hybrid FH-SS > > - Process Gain: 10 to 18 dB with DSSS / up to 30 dB with FHSS / > > 40 dB with Hybrid FH-SS > > - DSSS Chipset: STEL-2000A (same as Zilog Z87200) > > - FHSS Chip set: Analog Devices AD9955 (Fast option) / AD7008 > (Slow option) > > - "SMART" Radio Setup & Control: PIC 16C64A > > - HOST I/O: slow speed = RS-232 / high speed = Synchronous Serial > (SIO) port (HDLC-like) -- both I/O speeds use Tx / RX handshaking > > - Data Rates: 1 bps to >250 kbps > > - Master Clock: 80 MHz TCXO, freq. stability , +/- 10 ppm > > - Frequency Hopping Speed: 1 microsecond maximum, design goal > > - PN Codes: Fully Programmable in length and selection > > - FH Codes: Fully Programmable in length and selection > > - Multiple Access Capability: Fully Programmable / User selectable > > - Baseband Data Protocols: TBD / TBS > > - HOST / TNC Characteristics: To Be Developed > > - OSI Communication Modes / Level Definition: To Be Developed > > - Applications / Application Software: To Be Developed > > - Physical: Two PCBs - each about 3" x 5" (TWO sided), design goal > (See Baseband PCB Breadboard at top of page) > > - POWER Required: + 11 to 14 VDC at less than 1 amp > > - Other Characteristics: TBD / TBS > > PLEASE take a look at actual test results and breadboard pictures at my home > page: > > http://sss-mag.com/hamnotes.html > > Hope TAPR or some of you out there are interested. > > TNX & 73 > > de Randy Roberts, KC6YJY > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > At 04:14 PM 2/1/97 -0600, you wrote: > >There has been some discussion on the list about how TAPR does group purchases. > > > >Let me outline the unofficial policy. > > > >Basically, if someone can show something that is of interest to a critical > >mass of people such that it helps the membership of TAPR for TAPR to handle > >the ordering then the project will be considered by TAPR to be done. > > > >Examples have been the PC-DSP purchase just completed, the EVM56002 DSP > >units (which Dorothy is shipping the last of) and the Garmin GPS-20s. > > > >The issue that gets most potential purchases is that the markup of TAPR's > >overhead (Visa expense, shipping, office time, general overhead) has to be > >factored into the price of which the item can be handled by TAPR and > >provided to people for purchase. Many times, potential group deals do not > >gell, because the final price with overhead is not a significant enough > >savings for a group purchase to happen. > > > >We would be willing to entertain any of the notions or projects people have > >in mind, but has any of you looked at the pricing of the eval units that GEE Why do this when you can get a ATT&T WaveLAN CLONE for UNDER $500.00, it does 2MBS (I see 1.8MBS average with ftp.) I have a 20db Billateral amp on this puppy. I'm still only averaging 1Watt. The cool think about Spread Sectrum is that it's Omnipresent. Immune to noise but if your only pushing the 20mw that this guy is trying to sell you will be dronwed in an ocean of noise floor when there is snow on the ground! I know because I was playing with these cards at 250mw with the winpy indoor antennea that they ship with the product. I was able to get 1800ft out of these puppies until there was snow on the ground. Neighboring microwave uplinks and cell phone pads reaked havock on me so I picked up a couple od colinear antenneas and a billateral amp for my main router. 10 Miles NO PROBLEM. I can get more milage from hopping from router to router. I am working on some code that will minimize collisions. > >the mfg are offering. I know the Harris set costs around $3000+ to get all > >the various elements to make a working system. The loral SS eval board > >(which has no RF) costs about $2500 to get. I think we will find that any > >of these approaches will be cost limited. > > > >If someone has a concept for a project, we are all ears. We have already > >had two projects discussed very informally for TAPR to do. Both have been > >very speculative in nature and we are waiting to see if either will have > >anything done beyond just some basic thoughts. > > > >Talking about doing something is one thing, but doing it and following > >through the entire process is more than many realize the level of > >commitment. > > > >Cheers - Greg > > > >----- > >Greg Jones, WD5IVD > >Austin, Texas > >wd5ivd@tapr.org > >http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd > >----- From clearbrook_technical@mindlink.bc.ca Sun Feb 02 13:34:55 1997 Received: from linux.clrtech.com. (excel4.jumppoint.com [204.191.232.129]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id NAA02522 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 1997 13:34:51 -0600 (CST) Received: from fk-win.mtn.clrtech.com (fk-win.mtn.clrtech.com [172.17.100.103]) by linux.clrtech.com. (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id MAA14470 for ; Sun, 2 Feb 1997 12:41:10 -0800 Date: Sun, 2 Feb 1997 12:41:10 -0800 Message-Id: <199702022041.MAA14470@linux.clrtech.com.> X-Sender: clearbrook_technical@linux.clrtech.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: Clearbrook Technical Subject: Re: [SS:962] Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase At 09:32 PM 2/1/97 -0600, you wrote: >As a charter subscriber to Randy's Spread-spectrum magazine back in 1991-92, >I have always thought his designs, writing, and news on the RF designs for >ss have been ahead of anything else I could find. I certainly think the >offer he has made deserves attention. If his offer follows plans printed >early-on in his publications, it is probably easy to understand and to >build. de alan, wa9gka > > > I have visited this site from time to time as well and the modular approach that Randy uses sure looks like a good educational opportunity for coming up to speed on a new technology, i would be interested in something like this as a TAPR group purchase... my 2cents$C Fred Kehler (ve7ipb) Clearbrook Technical Services Ltd From glg@balrog.k8lt.ampr.org Mon Feb 03 00:01:15 1997 Received: from k8lt.ampr.org (balrog.mv.com [199.125.64.248]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id AAA14495 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 00:01:11 -0600 (CST) Received: by k8lt.ampr.org (Smail3.1.27.1 #9) id m0vrHRw-000OGMC; Mon, 3 Feb 97 01:00 EST Message-Id: X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.2 7/18/95 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:963] Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 01 Feb 1997 21:34:33 CST." <32F40856.AEB2048@ici.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Mon, 03 Feb 1997 01:00:16 -0500 From: "Gary L. Grebus" > ...Immune > to noise but if your only pushing the 20mw that this guy is trying to > sell you will be dronwed in an ocean of noise floor when there is > snow on the ground! Read the proposal more carefully. The device is intended for use with an external linear transverter which will provide the desired power level at the desired frequency. As you have pointed out over and over again, it is possible to build wireless data links using existing software and commercial wireless networking gear. But that is not the only goal. Some of us would like to understand the building blocks that go into that commercial wireless networking gear so that we might apply the technology to amateur radio applications. A Linux PC and a Wavelan card makes an excellent test bed, but it's probably not how you want to implement a handheld SS voice radio. 73, /gary Gary L. Grebus Home: glg@k8lt.ampr.org Brookline, NH Work: grebus@zk3.dec.com Ham Packet: K8LT@W1ON.FN42JM.MA.USA.NOAM From rero@cbmsmail.cb.lucent.com Mon Feb 03 08:26:04 1997 Received: from cbgw2.lucent.com (cbgw2.lucent.com [192.20.239.134]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id IAA09758 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 08:26:02 -0600 (CST) Received: from cbemg.cb.lucent.com by cbig2.firewall.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-L sol2) id JAA00582; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 09:24:32 -0500 Received: from cbemg.UUCP by cbemg.cb.lucent.com (4.1/EMS-L gis) id AA29641; Mon, 3 Feb 97 09:26:46 EST Date: 3 Feb 97 09:03:00 -0500 To: "ss" Received: from cbmsmail.cb.lucent.com by cbmsmail.cb.lucent.com; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 09:04 EST Received: by cbmsmail.cb.lucent.com with Microsoft Mail id <32F5F07C@cbmsmail.cb.lucent.com>; Mon Feb 03 09:04 EST 1997 From: "Rochford, Richard E." Original-To: "ss" Subject: RE: 930] Re: WaveLAN Performance (Was: *nix on floppy) Original-Date: Mon Feb 03 09:03 EST 1997 Message-Id: <32F5F07C@cbmsmail.cb.lucent.com> Encoding: 61 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Content-Type: text The MAC address must be different for every device manufactured. ---------- From: ss[SMTP:tapr.org!ss@cbemg] Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 1997 1:20 PM To: ss Subject: [SS:930] Re: WaveLAN Performance (Was: *nix on floppy) Jerry Normandin Replies: If anyone ever payed attention to my previous posts you'd notice that I had to modify the Linux driver for Wavelan because many of the new cards are manufactured by Lucent technologies and THEY changed the MAC address. The MAC address is checked upon driver initialization and if the MAC don't match the driver does not load. I rewrote my driver and it works fine!!!!!!!!!!! And to the turkey asking what Sr. stands for it's Senior Bernie Doehner wrote: > > > Indeed, I think it's time to put this wayward thread to rest. > > Second that! > > > have been achieved? What about driver issues? I've heard reports > > that the WaveLAN driver for Linux doesn't work with recent kernel > > versions - any experience out there? > > > > Can't comment about the Linux ISA driver. I can just say that the > wavelan driver from pcmcia-cs-2.9.0 works really well with kernel 2.0.27. > > I am involved with a FreeBSD developer in Australia and a professor at > Portland State University in testing/developing the FreeBSD 2.2 > driver for Wavelan. I am presently running this wavelan driver under > 2.2-BETA without any problems except that you can't set the IRQ with the > kernel quite yet (a checksum calculation routine needs to be fixed). > > Within my house I consistently get 190 kbyte/second ftp transfer speeds > when transfering large files and there are only two stations active. > > I haven't yet gotten to the point of trying out outdoor. > > Bernie -- Jerry Normandin, iCi Sr. Systems Engineer Tel.(508)261-0383 x1118 "I'm not only an iCi Staff member, I'm also a client!" From hilman@camosun.bc.ca Mon Feb 03 12:13:11 1997 Received: from ccins.camosun.bc.ca (ccins.camosun.bc.ca [204.174.56.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id MAA21909 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 12:13:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from hilman.cs.camosun.bc.ca (hilman.cs.camosun.bc.ca [204.174.57.91]) by ccins.camosun.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.3) with SMTP id KAA08635 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 10:13:04 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <32F6D561.7A4@camosun.bc.ca> Date: Mon, 03 Feb 1997 22:21:21 -0800 From: Don Hilman X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: New Radio Project Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I would be willing to add our support here at Camosun ( a technical college in Victoria) to do any testing and support work to develop what Randy has been describing. We have access to several Linux servers in lab and Spectrum Analyzers etc on the RF end. We are interested in building and testing any ss system as I will be using it as a demo in my networking or datacom labs for courses I teach to Computer Science students. The college is VE7CCD and I am VE7FBI. From n7oo@goodnet.com Mon Feb 03 12:44:21 1997 Received: from goodguy.goodnet.com (root@goodnet.com [207.98.129.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id MAA23436 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 12:44:18 -0600 (CST) Received: from goodguy (n7oo@mail [207.98.129.2]) by goodguy.goodnet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA20315 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 11:43:48 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 3 Feb 1997 11:43:48 -0700 (MST) From: Jack Taylor X-Sender: n7oo@goodguy To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:960] Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase In-Reply-To: <2.2.16.19970202093039.517fbce2@sss-mag.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I want to thank Randy for posting his offer and for providing an EXCELLENT web site for SS! The info and various tutorials have been printed out and have filled a good-sized 3 ring binder. My initial thoughts on Randy's proposed project is that it's really not necessary to get too basic as the tutorials do give adequate info on SS techniques. What we really need is an easily assembled configuration that can be quickly produced and put into service. I for one, would like to experiment with a SS backbone point-to-point link configuration, perhaps in the new 219 MHz range. One end would terminate at an internet gateway and the other at a nodestack. Many of us 'RF types' have the necessary test gear for the VHF/UHF bands and thus could get rolling much quicker than we could in the uwave regions. Whatever is developed, it would be highly desireable to have diagnostics available, perhaps in the form of BER. This would allow the sysops to keep track of factors affecting link performance 73 de Jack From fred@tekdata.com Mon Feb 03 12:58:50 1997 Received: from tekdata.com (pool13-024.wwa.com [206.222.42.121]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id MAA24277 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 12:58:41 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fred@localhost) by tekdata.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id LAA11076; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 11:00:19 -0600 Date: Mon, 3 Feb 1997 11:00:19 -0600 (CST) From: "Fred M. Spinner" To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:957] What next? (was Re: Point(Tony Lanier)) In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19970201220206.006be430@mail.mich.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sat, 1 Feb 1997, Jeff King wrote: > > But the FreeWave was a decent radio.... I'm not so sure what I am hearing > being discussed will even hold a candle to the FreeWave. For example, both > radios mentioned are 2.4ghz units.... most hams were going to be frequency > challenged at 900mhz let alone at 2.5ghz. I'm not saying I'm against 2.5ghz > development, I just want folks to be aware we are talking two different > animimals. Also, both 2.5ghz radios mentioned are 100mw > units, that and the reduction in sensitivity on both 2.5ghz units give > the FreeWave a 30db advantage. Also add in the fact it was a lower cost > radio and you come up with the same answer I did.... maybe we need to > think about what direction we are going before we leap. Actually, since you can use reflector antennas, IMHO is is probably a better band to use. Dishes are far less picky than Yagis are, have a better pattern, etc. The rule here is no feedline if possible. In my experience though, if the best you can do is a 3db loss before the antenna, use a 50% larger diameter dish! In practice with smaller dishes, this works well, at the expense of beamwidth, which for a user might be a benefit. (Obviously a center-of-a-hub station can't use a dish!) I wish more hams would play with microwaves. If you don't fear them, you'll find that they really aren't as difficult as many people let on. (For example: how many DSS systems are out there now? [2+ million] they run at over 12 GHz, and normal joe people can install them.....) > > However, my primary concern is having a development path that a proprietary > solution wouldn't give us. > Yup, but we need to keep in mind is that we are small, and they are big.. we are starting off at an disadvantage. BUT, part 97 rules are going to be less restrictive (hopefully!) so we as hams COULD use simpler systems. I really think what we are after are HIGH SPEED links more importantly than SS. If we use the microwave bands, we can use more BW, etc.. I hope any ham SS development will be for 1296 MHz or above.. Fred M. Spinner, KA9VAW fred@tekdata.com From n3jly@erols.com Mon Feb 03 22:34:16 1997 Received: from smtp1.erols.com (smtp1.erols.com [205.252.116.101]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id WAA28399 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 22:34:14 -0600 (CST) Received: from LOCALNAME (col-as6s37.erols.com [207.172.73.101]) by smtp1.erols.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA02023 for ; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 23:35:14 -0500 Date: Mon, 3 Feb 1997 23:35:14 -0500 Message-Id: <199702040435.XAA02023@smtp1.erols.com> X-Sender: n3jly@pop.erols.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: Tony McConnell Subject: Re: [SS:963] Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase At 09:34 PM 2/1/97 -0600, you wrote: >Randy Roberts wrote: >> >> OK folks, here goes -- ACTION, not talk! >> >> - Frequency Range: 24 to 34 MHz (TO BE USED with an OUTBOARD >> LINEAR TRANSVERTER for operating frequency band.) >> >> - TX output Power: > +13 dBm (20mw) average >> >> - RX NF: < 3 dB >> An opinion opposed to Randy Roberts proposal said: >The cool think about Spread Sectrum is that it's Omnipresent. Immune >to noise but if your only pushing the 20mw that this guy is trying to >sell you will be dronwed in an ocean of noise floor when there is >snow on the ground! I know because I was playing with these cards >at 250mw with the winpy indoor antennea that they ship with the product. >I was able to get 1800ft out of these puppies until there was snow >on the ground. Neighboring microwave uplinks and cell phone pads >reaked havock on me so I picked up a couple od colinear antenneas >and a billateral amp for my main router. 10 Miles NO PROBLEM. I can >get more milage from hopping from router to router. I am working on >some code that will minimize collisions. Please notice the proposal by Randy. he discribes a modulator/demodulator and IF arrangement. this seems like a very sound way to go. with the ability to softly control mode and width of spread. were talking about a band independant application. Tony N3JLI From wd5ivd@tapr.org Mon Feb 03 23:14:10 1997 Received: from [208.134.134.40] ([208.134.134.40]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id XAA00887; Mon, 3 Feb 1997 23:14:05 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Feb 1997 23:19:53 -0600 To: " Spread Spectrum " From: "Greg Jones, WD5IVD" Subject: Robert's Proposal If someone thinks they can put together a design team to do the Robert's design, TAPR would be interested in looking at the design/cost of such a project. Please send me e-mail to me if you think you have a group that can do this and want to pursue the necessary _work_ in starting a project. Until a design team can be formed to even look at the possibility of doing the design, TAPR is not in a position to do anything with the proposal. Cheers - Greg, WD5IVD Pres. TAPR ----- Greg Jones, WD5IVD Austin, Texas wd5ivd@tapr.org http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd ----- From bruce@satscan.com Tue Feb 04 09:11:40 1997 Received: from satscan.com (root@satscan.com [205.199.65.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id JAA00368 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 1997 09:11:37 -0600 (CST) From: bruce@satscan.com Received: from 205.199.65.1 (boris.satscan.com [205.199.65.4]) by satscan.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id HAA03624 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 1997 07:14:50 -0800 Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 07:14:50 -0800 Message-Id: <199702041514.HAA03624@satscan.com> X-Sender: bruce@satscan.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:971] Robert's Proposal Why do we need a design team for something that has allready been designed? >Until a design team can be formed to even look at the possibility of doing >the design, TAPR is not in a position to do anything with the proposal. > >Cheers - Greg, WD5IVD >Pres. TAPR > >----- >Greg Jones, WD5IVD >Austin, Texas >wd5ivd@tapr.org >http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd >----- > > > Bruce Weber, W7BCW, Satscan Corporation / Cascade Technology PO Box 1109, Sultan WA 98294-1109 (360)-793-3433 FAX: 793-0359 From wd5ivd@tapr.org Tue Feb 04 10:38:11 1997 Received: from [208.134.134.40] ([208.134.134.40]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id KAA05487 for ; Tue, 4 Feb 1997 10:38:09 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199702041514.HAA03624@satscan.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Feb 1997 10:43:45 -0600 To: ss@tapr.org From: "Greg Jones, WD5IVD" Subject: Re: [SS:972] Re: Robert's Proposal Okay -- we can talk about syntax. A design is one thing and a group that takes it and does something with it is a different task, but still part of the design process. I believe it is all design until the unit is out the door for the rev 1 unit. How about Layout ? Design for surface mount ? Locating mfg of parts ? Pricing parts ? Can it be kitted or mfg with testing ? Docs written ? Testing done on initial boards....etc, etc, etc. If you don't like 'design' as a name -- chose project team. If the design was already complete, then we would have it in our hand working -- right ? So, this seems to indicate that more work is required. If I have this wrong and the design is ready and working, then I think we need to look at finding a mfg like PacComm or someone else to start mfg now and not involve TAPR in the process at all. A mfg can get to market in a much quicker time then a TAPR project, simply the difference between volunteers working at night and on weekends and someone getting paid to work on it all day. While there might be a basic design done, there is a lot more work that some 'group' is going to have to do before we even begin looking at whether TAPR does this or discussing the proposal that Randy made and signing something. This type of project will not be done by a dislocated group of people connected over the Internet. Sorry to say this, but past experience indicates that a small project team or design group that is physically located in some near area (i.e. local telephone, can visit on the weekends) __especially for RF projects__ is needed if we want to get this thing done in less than a year. This is based on doing project like this with volunteers for over 5 years. After the initial questions are answered and something is alpha tested with radios talking back and forth then the next step of taking it further can happen. Cheers - Greg >Why do we need a design team for something that has allready been designed? > > >>Until a design team can be formed to even look at the possibility of doing >>the design, TAPR is not in a position to do anything with the proposal. >> >>Cheers - Greg, WD5IVD >>Pres. TAPR >> >>----- >>Greg Jones, WD5IVD >>Austin, Texas >>wd5ivd@tapr.org >>http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd >>----- >> >> >> >Bruce Weber, W7BCW, Satscan Corporation / Cascade Technology >PO Box 1109, Sultan WA 98294-1109 (360)-793-3433 FAX: 793-0359 ----- Greg Jones, WD5IVD Austin, Texas wd5ivd@tapr.org http://www.tapr.org/~wd5ivd ----- From randyrf@sss-mag.com Wed Feb 05 19:37:53 1997 Received: from nanospace.com (root@nanos1.nanospace.com [205.199.199.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id TAA21436 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 1997 19:37:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from pa01-06.nanospace.com ([205.199.196.106]) by nanospace.com with smtp id (Smail3.1.29.1); Wed, 5 Feb 97 17:37 PST Date: Wed, 5 Feb 97 17:37 PST Message-Id: <2.2.16.19970206093650.0e97b1de@sss-mag.com> X-Sender: randyrf@sss-mag.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) To: ss@tapr.org From: Randy Roberts Subject: Re: SS:938 & SS:960 Here's a little more ACTION for the SS adventuresome out there in TAPR-land: I have posted schematics, PCB files & basic 16C64 microprocessor code up on my site for some of the SST-1 radio-modem -- for your viewing and downloading pleasure! Take a look at: http://sss-mag.com/whatsnew/nuissue.html#3 A BARE PCB for the "Baseband" section of the SST-1 will be available soon at US$39 each -- see above link for more info. BTW, this project was originally dubbed the "VAPOR1" as a play on words -- it has now become the SST-1, but some of the files still have vapor'ish names :-) 73 for now, Randy, KC6YJY From randyrf@sss-mag.com Wed Feb 05 22:40:25 1997 Received: from nanospace.com (root@nanos1.nanospace.com [205.199.199.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id WAA02458 for ; Wed, 5 Feb 1997 22:40:23 -0600 (CST) Received: from pa01-02.nanospace.com ([205.199.196.102]) by nanospace.com with smtp id (Smail3.1.29.1); Wed, 5 Feb 97 20:40 PST Date: Wed, 5 Feb 97 20:40 PST Message-Id: <2.2.16.19970206123929.3adf07c8@sss-mag.com> X-Sender: randyrf@sss-mag.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 1 (Highest) To: ss@tapr.org From: Randy Roberts Subject: Link Correction OOPS! -:( I goofed the CORRECT URL should be: http://sss-mag.com/whatsnew/nuindex.html#3 My thanks to Lyle Johnson for catching this! 73 to one & all, Randy From fields@svpal.org Thu Feb 06 16:59:49 1997 Received: from svpal.svpal.org (fields@svpal.svpal.org [204.118.32.56]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id QAA29591 for ; Thu, 6 Feb 1997 16:59:46 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fields@localhost) by svpal.svpal.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA20955; Thu, 6 Feb 1997 14:58:56 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 14:58:56 -0800 (PST) From: Carol Fields Subject: Low noise reciever RF front end To: ss@tapr.org In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII What technology is the low cost (under $10)/high quality front end for a receiver of a SS receiver? Gallium arsenide? Bipolar? HEMT? Other? How about Noise Factor of various semiconductor technologies? Specifics: I see Mini-Circuits has a ERA-3 (non-surface mount) for under $2 which has 16dB gain at 5Ghz. It also has other specs below: NF db Typ: 4.5 IP3 dBm Typ: 23 It is interesting that ERA-3 has better gain than ERA-3SM (surface mount) and I wonder if this is due to the 1/4 turn curve in the ERA-3SM leads verses the straight wire leads of the ERA-3? Is there anything better (How about NEC's CEL division?)? FIELDS@SVPAL.ORG Home email account of Julian Fields From glenne@hpsadr2.sr.hp.com Fri Feb 07 10:40:19 1997 Received: from palrel1.hp.com (palrel1.hp.com [15.253.72.10]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id KAA26618 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:40:18 -0600 (CST) Received: from srmail.sr.hp.com (srmail.sr.hp.com [15.4.45.14]) by palrel1.hp.com with ESMTP (8.7.5/8.7.3) id IAA09959 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 08:40:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from hpsadr2.sr.hp.com (n6gn.sr.hp.com) by srmail.sr.hp.com with ESMTP (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA147233614; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 08:40:16 -0800 Received: by hpsadr2.sr.hp.com (1.37.109.16/15.5+ECS 3.3) id AA231633613; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 08:40:13 -0800 From: Glenn Elmore Message-Id: <199702071640.AA231633613@hpsadr2.sr.hp.com> Subject: Low noise reciever RF front end To: ss@tapr.org Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 08:40:13 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <199702070415.WAA15015@tapr.org> from "ss@tapr.org" at Feb 6, 97 10:15:41 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Carol Fields > What technology is the low cost (under $10)/high quality front > end for a receiver of a SS receiver? > Gallium arsenide? > Bipolar? > HEMT? > Other? > How about Noise Factor of various semiconductor technologies? > > Specifics: I see Mini-Circuits has a ERA-3 (non-surface mount) for under $2 > which has 16dB gain at 5Ghz. It also has other specs below: > NF db Typ: 4.5 > IP3 dBm Typ: 23 > > It is interesting that ERA-3 has better gain than ERA-3SM (surface mount) > and I wonder if this is due to the 1/4 turn curve in the ERA-3SM > leads verses the straight wire leads of the ERA-3? > Is there anything better (How about NEC's CEL division?)? > The ERA and similar HBT parts have pretty good gain/$ and generally nice performance, but.... There is presently a great deal of concern about the HBT process itself and early failure due to it. It is very possible/likely that package parasitics provide the difference in performance. Particularly in higher frequency devices and in high gain, higher current (low Z) parts the common mode impedance gets important. For some devices (like Avantek microwave gain blocks) it is necessary to use board material thinner than 1/16" because of grounding via inductance limitations. Glenn n6gn From fields@svpal.org Fri Feb 07 17:20:26 1997 Received: from svpal.svpal.org (fields@svpal.svpal.org [204.118.32.56]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA19800 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 17:20:25 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fields@localhost) by svpal.svpal.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id PAA09072; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 15:19:34 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 15:19:34 -0800 (PST) From: Carol Fields Subject: Freq hopping support chips To: ss@tapr.org Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Are there any integrated circuits that will hop thru the 75 or 150 or more frequencies to generate the frequency to mix down to intermediate frequency as required for Part 15 on 2.4Ghz or 5Ghz band frequency hopper? Or do the present vendors roll their own circuits by mux'ing between 2 or 3 PLL's? Not really going to build this anytime soon, but figured somebody knew the low cost/easy way to do it. It also seems that hitting 75 freq rapidly would be quite a difficult task... not to mention the harder task of having the reciever hit exactly the same 75 freq at the right time. -Julian Fields From wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org Fri Feb 07 23:06:24 1997 Received: from wb9mjn.ampr.org (wb9mjn.ampr.org [44.72.98.19]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id XAA07643 for ; Fri, 7 Feb 1997 23:06:07 -0600 (CST) From: wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org Date: Fri, 07 Feb 97 22:40:26 UTC Message-Id: <12709@wb9mjn.ampr.org> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:978] Freq hopping support chips In-Reply-To: your message of Fri Feb 07 17:24:05 1997 Hi Julian, Altho a single PLL can synthesise 75 to 150 frequencies, on 2.4 and 5 Ghz, as you guessed the problem is how quick. Yes, multiple PLL s are used, to achieve quick enuf hopping for fast FH systems. Each PLL in turn is preset, and with a saftey time, it is switched to the output as it is expected to have stabilised on channel. At 5 Ghz, Fractional N synthesis PLLs may be neccassary for phase noise reasons. Another way, would be to mix up a Direct Digital Synthesis synthesizer output. These can change frequency rapidly, but are limited in operating frequency. They also can be quite expensive for high purity, due to D/A costs. Some of the SS chips i ve seen so far have a AFC, to counter synthesizer errors. At a megabaud or so on 2.4, and probably 5 GHz, too, this is not a great problem. For 50 KB or less on 915, I would think it can be. I did a 9600 Baud link on 1.2 Ghz not spread, and it certainly was a problem. In fact, I need to go over to one site next week sometime and tweak it in! 73, Don. Mailbox : WB9MJN @ N9HSI.IL.USA.NA AMPRNet : wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org[44.72.98.19] Internet: wb9mjn%wb9mjn.ampr.org@uugate.aim.utah.edu From jmorriso@bogomips.com Sat Feb 08 18:00:09 1997 Received: from orange.ConcordPacific.Com (root@orange.ConcordPacific.com [204.239.26.10]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id SAA08777 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 1997 18:00:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from bogomips.com (root@bogomips.com [206.108.196.1]) by orange.ConcordPacific.Com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with SMTP id QAA02371 for ; Sat, 8 Feb 1997 16:00:16 -0800 Received: by bogomips.com (Linux Smail3.1.29.1 #3) id m0vtMhG-000TsoC; Sat, 8 Feb 97 16:00 PST Message-Id: From: jmorriso@bogomips.com (John Paul Morrison) Subject: cheap WaveLAN cards? To: ss@tapr.org Date: Sat, 8 Feb 1997 16:00:42 -0800 (PST) X-Bogomips: 33.55 Content-Type: text Does anyone know where it may be possible to get two or three ISA WaveLAN cards cheaply (used, discounts, special sales) for use by an amateur radio club? thanks --------------------------------------------------------------------------- BogoMIPS Research Labs -- bogosity research & simulation -- VE7JPM -- jmorriso@bogomips.com ve7jpm@ve7jpm.ampr.org jmorriso@ve7ubc.ampr.org --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ScottE@ix.netcom.com Mon Feb 10 11:38:44 1997 Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id LAA21494 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 11:38:43 -0600 (CST) Received: from den-co26-23.ix.netcom.com (den-co8-15.ix.netcom.com [204.31.232.79]) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA14106 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 09:38:11 -0800 Received: by den-co26-23.ix.netcom.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BC173E.5A6F5C30@den-co26-23.ix.netcom.com>; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 10:37:03 -0700 Message-ID: <01BC173E.5A6F5C30@den-co26-23.ix.netcom.com> From: Scott Elliott To: "'SS'" Subject: Harris Prism chip Set Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 10:36:58 -0700 Return-Receipt-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Greetings, I've just joined the list and have a hardware question, but fist let me = introduce my self. My technician call sign is KB0ZOE and it is fresh = out of the shrink wrap. I am an electrical engineer at Laser = Communications in Englewood, Colorado. My only experience with SS is = with the old Proxim 902 MHz net cards (not a good experience).=20 I was wondering if anybody has looked at the Harris Prism DSSS chip set = or used their PCMCIA demo card (http://www.semi.harris.com)? Their demo = card used AMD's 802.11 MAC chip, does anybody have any thoughts on that = chip or standard (http://www.amd.com)? Thanks in advance, Scott Elliott KB0ZOE From rlanier@su102s.ess.harris.com Mon Feb 10 15:52:20 1997 Received: from ess.harris.com (su15a.ess.harris.com [130.41.1.251]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id PAA05233 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 15:51:57 -0600 (CST) Received: from losalamos.ess.harris.com (su102s.ess.harris.com [130.41.13.101]) by ess.harris.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA28439 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 16:51:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from Paris.GASD102designcenter by losalamos.ess.harris.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04681; Mon, 10 Feb 97 16:51:52 EST Received: by Paris.GASD102designcenter (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA00560; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 16:51:49 -0500 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 16:51:49 -0500 From: rlanier@su102s.ess.harris.com (Tony Lanier) Message-Id: <199702102151.QAA00560@Paris.GASD102designcenter> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:981] Harris Prism chip Set X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII > Greetings, > > I've just joined the list and have a hardware question, but fist let me introduce my self. My technician call sign is KB0ZOE and it is fresh out of the shrink wrap. I am an electrical engineer at Laser Communications in Englewood, Colorado. My only experience with SS is with the old Proxim 902 MHz net cards (not a good experience). > > I was wondering if anybody has looked at the Harris Prism DSSS chip set or used their PCMCIA demo card (http://www.semi.harris.com)? Their demo card used AMD's 802.11 MAC chip, does anybody have any thoughts on that chip or standard (http://www.amd.com)? > > Thanks in advance, > > Scott Elliott > KB0ZOE > > Hi Scott, Yes we have discussed the PRISM chipset. I have a pair of the chipsets and I will be using them for a project. I want to get up and running with them and then develop a more complex SS system. The only problem I have encountered with the PRISM chipset is the size of the parts: they are SMALL !!! If an adapter can be found to convert the parts to a dip-style package, then breadboarding shouldn't be a problem. I haven't contacted the approiate people about availablity of the eval boards (i.e. can I purchase just the p.c. board). The eval board leans to the 802.11 standard and I would rather use the chipset as a amateur SS springboard. Tony KE4ATO From bad@uhf.wireless.net Mon Feb 10 17:54:17 1997 Received: from uhf.wdc.net (uhf.wdc.net [198.147.74.44]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA12300 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:54:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (bad@localhost) by uhf.wdc.net (8.8.4/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA03999 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 19:00:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 19:00:24 -0500 (EST) From: Bernie Doehner To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:981] Harris Prism chip Set In-Reply-To: <01BC173E.5A6F5C30@den-co26-23.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > Greetings, > > I've just joined the list and have a hardware question, but fist let me introduce my self. My technician call sign is KB0ZOE and it is fresh out of the shrink wrap. I am an electrical engineer at Laser Communications in Englewood, Colorado. My only experience with SS is with the old Proxim 902 MHz net cards (not a good experience). > > I was wondering if anybody has looked at the Harris Prism DSSS chip set or used their PCMCIA demo card (http://www.semi.harris.com)? Their demo card used AMD's 802.11 MAC chip, does anybody have any thoughts on that chip or standard (http://www.amd.com)? > > Thanks in advance, > > Scott Elliott > KB0ZOE > Hi Scott: Harris will be coming by our lab on friday with a set of their PCMCIA cards. Ask me again next week! Bernie From bad@uhf.wireless.net Mon Feb 10 17:56:03 1997 Received: from uhf.wdc.net (uhf.wdc.net [198.147.74.44]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA12381 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:55:58 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (bad@localhost) by uhf.wdc.net (8.8.4/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA04003 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 19:02:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 19:02:16 -0500 (EST) From: Bernie Doehner To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set In-Reply-To: <199702102151.QAA00560@Paris.GASD102designcenter> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > SMALL !!! If an adapter can be found to convert the parts to a dip-style package, then ^^^^^^^ Would be nice, but at 2.4 GHz. the leads have too much inductance! Bernie From ScottE@ix.netcom.com Mon Feb 10 18:03:58 1997 Received: from dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com ([206.214.98.16]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id SAA12828 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 18:03:56 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id SAA29754 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 18:02:48 -0600 (CST) Received: from den-co8-15.ix.netcom.com(204.31.232.79) by dfw-ix16.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id sma029721; Mon Feb 10 18:02:45 1997 Received: by SCOTT with Microsoft Mail id <01BC1774.129E9840@SCOTT>; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:01:35 -0700 Message-ID: <01BC1774.129E9840@SCOTT> From: Scott Elliott To: "'ss@tapr.org'" Subject: RE: 982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:01:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BC1774.129E9840" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC1774.129E9840 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Tony Lanier Sent: Monday, February 10, 1997 2:56 PM To: ss@tapr.org Subject: [SS:982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set Hi Scott, Yes we have discussed the PRISM chipset. I have a pair of the chipsets = and I will be using them for a project. I want to get up and running with them and then develop a = more complex SS system. The only problem I have encountered with the PRISM chipset is the size = of the parts: they are SMALL !!! If an adapter can be found to convert the parts to a dip-style = package, then=20 breadboarding shouldn't be a problem. I haven't contacted the approiate = people about availablity of the eval boards (i.e. can I purchase just the p.c. board). The eval = board leans to the 802.11 standard and I would rather use the chipset as a amateur SS springboard. Tony KE4ATO Tony, Boy, you sure are right about bread boarding 0.025" pitch surface mount = IC's. The only way I know to handle them is to fire up the old CAD = system and layout a board. If you need some help with a board I might = be able to squeeze out some time. I seem to remember that they do have their reference design sans the = 802.11 MAC in a PCMCIA form factor. Without the MAC the card is, of = course, not PCMCIA compatible. What you get out of it is just a bit = stream. They also have a demo board for each chip. I suppose that you = would just jumper all the boards together and fire it up. The specs on the Prism reference design look good to me (e.g. the = sensitivity of 87dBm should give it good range) but I don't pretend to = have a firm grasp on what to look for. I've also seen some data sheets = for AMI and Stanford Telecom but I'm not sure how to evaluate these with = out a reference design. Are their any other chip sets that you could = recommend? As far as protocols, what has been done to support these SS chip set for = AX.25 or other amateur protocols. I want to run what ever I do under NT = so that throws me out of the main stream, I know, but I can always hope. 73 Scott KB0ZOE ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC1774.129E9840 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IiMAAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYA9AAAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAANQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAHNzQHRhcHIub3JnAFNN VFAAc3NAdGFwci5vcmcAAAAAHgACMAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAAAwAAABzc0B0YXBy Lm9yZwADABUMAQAAAAMA/g8GAAAAHgABMAEAAAAOAAAAJ3NzQHRhcHIub3JnJwAAAAIBCzABAAAA EQAAAFNNVFA6U1NAVEFQUi5PUkcAAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAI5 JAEEgAEAIwAAAFJFOiA5ODJdIFJlOiBIYXJyaXMgUHJpc20gY2hpcCBTZXQAxgoBBYADAA4AAADN BwIACgARAAEAGgABAA0BASCAAwAOAAAAzQcCAAoAEAAiACcAAQA6AQEJgAEAIQAAAEVDMzY0Nzcz ODA4M0QwMTE4MjNEMDBBMDI0Qzk0MURCAO4GAQOQBgAMCAAAFAAAAAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAAL ACkAAQAAAAMALgAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAMAvSua4XvAEeAHAAAQAAACMAAABSRTogOTgyXSBS ZTogSGFycmlzIFByaXNtIGNoaXAgU2V0AAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABvBeuuchzRzbtg4AR0II9AKAk yUHbAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAAFQAAAFNjb3R0RUBpeC5uZXRjb20uY29t AAAAAAMABhDTqQ1CAwAHEA4GAAAeAAgQAQAAAGUAAAAtLS0tLS0tLS0tRlJPTTpUT05ZTEFOSUVS U0VOVDpNT05EQVksRkVCUlVBUlkxMCwxOTk3Mjo1NlBNVE86U1NAVEFQUk9SR1NVQkpFQ1Q6U1M6 OTgyUkU6SEFSUklTUFJJU01DAAAAAAIBCRABAAAAcgYAAG4GAADrCgAATFpGdey3DbX/AAoBDwIV AqQD5AXrAoMAUBMDVAIAY2gKwHNldO4yBgAGwwKDMgPGBxMCgyIzD3poZWwDIERs6mcCgzQTDX0K gAjPCdniOxefMjU1AoAKgQ2xwQtgbmcxMDMUIAsDIGxpMTgwAtFpLXgxNDQN8AzQHAMLWTG2Ngqg A2B0BZAFQC0eJ68KhxzbDDAdpkYDYTofLhMdpgyCIFQCIHkgTP8AcAiRHs8f3QZgAjAhDyIbQk0C IGRheSwgsGV4YnJ1CsAjEBrAKBAxADk5NyAyOjU2+CBQTSOfH90i4CXfIhutBBBAAZAdoC4FsGcp z3EkrnViah3hK+8iG1uAU1M6OTgyXQfwumUw4EgKwAUQBCBQM8HcbSARsAUgBlF0CoUKi/kbYDM2 HKcVwgwBHaYKhVxIaQYABaACQCw07FlRB5F3ZSARwHY6EGSZBABjdQQQCYAgdBTwYSmQUklTTTRT EfEupCBJOiRhIAqwaQXA/G9mOxM7xQQgAHA7ADxQuwPwFRFiOhA6wAuAZzsS/m0KhQIQBcA8wQNg MKI8MoZ3AHAFQHRvIGcSAO8/ADSQPjIoYG4DAD9BA/D/OyA/Yz4jOyEDoA2wOlAXMH1CASAEYBeg NFADcAtQZUZ4BgAF8HN5cx3QbdouCoVUOzECIGwjEB2h/wJgQ1E8VQnwBaBCcB3QF6G7Qtc7XCAz 0UkiAJB6RrF/PUQKsT4AMOBJISMQCsBlgwqFO5BBTEwgIU0w9zxAPUADkWEn4AUwBJA0UH8DkT7h AhBCcDsBQZAFoG4/OlAAIEsoQXI8wDqAcC2NRdB5RUA80WNrYUGw7ygQQ8MKhShQZU3QBuALEQk/ MnNoCGBsZG4n/wVAPuFAY0dSPDZT8k9RAZB/HfA69S4AHaEHMB3QPNBl/0RgUTEBoAhgBUA6QAtw C2D7AmBC8HkKhT01RCAHQD7Qw1MSBCAoaS5lPDBOUp08UHAIcBGxEfAgajrA2U+1LmM8MFMDKTww RpJ9WZggRUAGIkGBSSIbkDL4LjExCoVF0D4xXbI+Nf9TskJQVvAU8AXAOsA6ED1p/zywPhE8sADA HdAIcEVzHaAfPzFTA0YWRiYi8iBLRfA0QVRPNO42mjVMC1U7EvIMAWMAQCLTON1Cb/0oAXkIYC2w CHA8oUTRBRB8Z2hX4VezUrNZ1D8yMPIuXtA1IjzQQvARsGsiPmYA0DoQBGBIUTxAQyc+czwwRohB MCMQPFBrbv5vB+BBgRHAJ9BRMUMzSkJ/QZAb0ETRQfFJIgbwOwBD/EFERaU+IwtgavFX4VnUt29h TXFq8m4J4DsAcwNwvzoRFQA0kELjdIU8QW1r06dUMkdRQXJzcQpQZUrS+1fRdeN0B3FkDTxQEfBD Uf9BgRegB4AG0E4hSSBW8EvUvmRw4jpRSSE9ARegZkiB30ggOmEHkGvQA6BzXhNelzkF0EFDSjBN sSmQQ034Q0lBQBI0QG5xQYAuIP1lMFdC8VfCSSJ/gj1jXbL/BAAoED0xSDER4SgQcJAFQPeAFUUC VvBpR1GBMnwCavL/QbJXwj0xQvBKMlujdIGGod9F0FLBVOFGgkwRbHXgPGb/DbAEYF2FQCJS0G4R NGJ08vtrIVagb2FjhYVghFujW6D/RSBOIQdAAyBJIlnlQYBBsf9hEj4yciOGoUHwZA5KglcwfmME IAIgSRQ0E31/FzBvXmtBoJMwTwN2AShagGffPDBKcwnwAJB5kHZYgT0i8Dg3ZEI0QFOUQaCVIM+P Q5NzYOAaoGUpPtBX0f88UHyQU/IdoBIACfBPAzx1v3IhNEAJwFtgNJCRQXd8A+9BkJMjQCF08ic8 koiieuH/fmF18ifgAZBTgQngPgFAIuxBTTxQPjJTX6FAITsA3lQVAAWRNECXwyc0QIPi/2szU6Bw s1mSKHBXAUkhW3H/QuN0RJIeb2EHEHz2AHCVYf9hAzRjPeOLp0gxYLKfMgeA9SfQPzTsQZ2RCsFi UR2i/m8XEYMBmoNbUT7RQ+ICIH94NIsyT6RbcUWBpRadpFj+LhnQPSA9EY6EYrWox4rT/0E2QmGa dEQheqJ8kU7hTiHcTlR10XvmA2B3BCB2Af+GNUkiAMB/wYe0KBBwZCgQ/5fETlIHQHAhBCBToFcw ZA0cNzM07DiDZUBCMFp8T0U1XxynaMU3bRbBAAG7oAAAAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAEAABzCQuHL7 qhe8AUAACDCQuHL7qhe8AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAAAAAAAwANNP03AACnmA== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC1774.129E9840-- From lylej@azstarnet.com Mon Feb 10 19:55:13 1997 Received: from mailhost.azstarnet.com (mailhost.azstarnet.com [169.197.1.8]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id TAA18534 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 19:55:11 -0600 (CST) Received: from tomswift (usr1ip28.azstarnet.com [169.197.2.28]) by mailhost.azstarnet.com (8.8.3-p/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA23686 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 18:49:43 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970210184942.0070c8c8@pop.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: lylej@pop.azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 18:53:42 -0700 To: ss@tapr.org From: Lyle Johnson Subject: Re: [SS:982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Tony, I think breadboarding would be a problem with a DIP adapter. Some of these parts are operating at 2.4 GHz. I think the best bet may be to follow the Harris reference design up to the processor interface. If the AMD MAC chip isn't flexible enough to provide whatever protocol layers it ought to be responsible for, then we ned to find another interface chip. Cheers, Lyle From beltrani@hawaii.edu Mon Feb 10 21:46:49 1997 Received: from relay1.Hawaii.Edu (root@relay1.Hawaii.Edu [128.171.3.53]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA23874 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 21:46:47 -0600 (CST) Received: from uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu ([128.171.44.54]) by relay1.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <586857(4)>; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:43:18 -1000 Received: from localhost by uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <216729(9)>; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:46:28 -1000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:46:26 -1000 From: Paul A Beltrani X-Sender: beltrani@uhunix4 Reply-To: beltrani@pixi.com To: ss@tapr.org Subject: TAPR SS-List Project? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII After the problems with the group purchase, there was some discussion regarding developing of our own SS project. As I recall, the last two major items regarding an SS-list project were: 1) The generous proposal of KC6YJY regarding the 3 year use of his design. 2) A reality check by someone (WD5IVD?) regarding the difficulty a developing a hardware project across a large geographical area. Is there (still) interest in jointly developing some universal SS building blocks for use by the amateur community? The TNC made it easy for the average ham to get into packet. Most operators have little clue as to its inner workings, but they have made a tremendous impact on the amateur community as a whole. While I am not suggesting we attempt to duplicate the success of the TNC, I believe we would be doing a great service to Amateurs if we developed some public domain, basic hardware designs that experimenters could rally around. - Paul Beltrani, AH6NU From beltrani@hawaii.edu Mon Feb 10 21:48:07 1997 Received: from relay1.Hawaii.Edu (root@relay1.Hawaii.Edu [128.171.3.53]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA23962 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 21:48:04 -0600 (CST) Received: from uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu ([128.171.44.54]) by relay1.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <586843(7)>; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:44:35 -1000 Received: from localhost by uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <216725(10)>; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:47:49 -1000 Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 17:47:48 -1000 From: Paul A Beltrani X-Sender: beltrani@uhunix4 Reply-To: beltrani@pixi.com To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Looking for SS Chipset net sites Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I am attempting to put together a web page pointing to SS chipsets and RF ICs people are interested in experimenting with, e.g. The Harris PRISM set, The RF Devices RF2423 100 mW SS Tx IC. I am not attempting to include related chips such as pc interface chips or various protocol ICs. If you know of a web or FTP site that has such info, I would appreciate it if you would email me its full url, e.g. http://www.semi.harris.com/prism.html NOT www.semi.harris. In other words, I am looking for direct pointers to the information, not general web sites. I will make these sites available from my page at http://www.pixi.com/~beltrani/ah6nu.htm Thanks. - Paul Beltrani, AH6NU From LBUSH@eramp.net Mon Feb 10 22:02:38 1997 Received: from www (www.eramp.net [206.149.42.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id WAA24531 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:02:36 -0600 (CST) Received: from default by www (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA18050; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:01:14 -0600 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970211040318.006bd918@ERAMP.NET> X-Sender: LBUSH@ERAMP.NET X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:03:18 -0600 To: ss@tapr.org From: LARRY BUSH Subject: Tech manual 916A I need a Xerox copy of tech manual for General Radio model 916A RF impedance bridge. Will pay costs for copy and mail, etc. Larry Bush, W5NCD 359 Arrowhead Point Waco, Texas 76712 phone 817-848-5155 Fax # 817-299-1040 From jeff@mich.com Mon Feb 10 22:16:26 1997 Received: from server1.mich.com (root@server1.mich.com [198.108.16.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id WAA25465 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 22:16:23 -0600 (CST) Received: from gw-aerodata.mich.com (gw-aerodata.mich.com [198.108.16.240]) by server1.mich.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id XAA27384 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 23:19:38 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970211041607.0071cae0@mail.mich.com> X-Sender: jeff@mail.mich.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 23:16:07 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: Jeff King Subject: Re: [SS:983] Re: Harris Prism chip Set At 06:02 PM 2/10/97 -0600, Bernie Doehner wrote: >Hi Scott: > >Harris will be coming by our lab on friday with a set of their PCMCIA >cards. Ask me again next week! > >Bernie > Is this the 'PRISM PC Card Wireless LAN'? In the ap note it wasn't clear if this was a ISA design or a PCMCIA design. It uses the AM79C930 MAC processor. Anyone have one of these beasties yet? Lyle, did you? How much are the eval units going for... I think the eval unit is a two board set with WIN95 drivers. -Jeff wb8wka From jsanfor@exis.net Mon Feb 10 23:02:24 1997 Received: from marlin.exis.net (marlin.exis.net [205.252.72.102]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id XAA27638 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 23:02:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from LOCALNAME (ppp-3-94.exis.net [205.252.76.94]) by marlin.exis.net (8.8.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA06906 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 00:02:20 -0500 Message-ID: <32FFF6E8.A7E@exis.net> Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 23:34:48 -0500 From: Jim Sanford Reply-To: jsanfor@exis.net Organization: WB4GCS X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:989] Tech manual 916A References: <2.2.32.19970211040318.006bd918@ERAMP.NET> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit LARRY BUSH wrote: > > I need a Xerox copy of tech manual for General Radio model 916A RF > impedance bridge. Will pay costs for copy and mail, etc. > Larry Bush, W5NCD > 359 Arrowhead Point > Waco, Texas 76712 > phone 817-848-5155 > Fax # 817-299-1040 Larry: I may have one, but won't know until the weekend. (I'm on the road) Give me a call Saturday afternoon, or send another email... 757-850-4939 73, Jim wb4gcs@amsat.org From bad@uhf.wireless.net Mon Feb 10 23:16:40 1997 Received: from uhf.wdc.net (uhf.wdc.net [198.147.74.44]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id XAA28485 for ; Mon, 10 Feb 1997 23:16:31 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (bad@localhost) by uhf.wdc.net (8.8.4/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA05013 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 00:14:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 00:13:34 -0500 (EST) From: Bernie Doehner To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:990] Re: Harris Prism chip Set In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19970211041607.0071cae0@mail.mich.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Is this the 'PRISM PC Card Wireless LAN'? In the ap note it wasn't clear > if this was a ISA design or a PCMCIA design. It uses the AM79C930 MAC > processor. PCMCIA design. > Anyone have one of these beasties yet? Lyle, did you? How much are the > eval units going for... I think the eval unit is a two board set with > WIN95 drivers. Time for someone to write some Linux and BSD drivers :) Bernie From coccpce@mailbox.nauta.it Tue Feb 11 01:37:21 1997 Received: from mail.nauta.it (root@tamata.nauta.it [194.21.179.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id BAA13255 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 01:37:17 -0600 (CST) Received: from coccpce.nauta.it (coccpce.nauta.it [194.21.180.3]) by mail.nauta.it (8.6.12/8.6.9) with SMTP id IAA11534 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 08:37:04 +0100 Message-ID: <33009F2D.6B57@mailbox.nauta.it> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 08:32:45 -0800 From: Stefano Coccon Organization: P.C.E. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:987] TAPR SS-List Project? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Paul A Beltrani wrote: > > After the problems with the group purchase, there was some discussion > regarding developing of our own SS project. As I recall, the last two > major items regarding an SS-list project were: > > 1) The generous proposal of KC6YJY regarding the 3 year use of his > design. > It is better to develope a device for operations in the high UHF band. > 2) A reality check by someone (WD5IVD?) regarding the difficulty a > developing a hardware project across a large geographical area. > It is really difficult, but why to reject 'a priori' a new challenge? > Is there (still) interest in jointly developing some universal SS building > blocks for use by the amateur community? > Yes of course. > The TNC made it easy for the average ham to get into packet. Most > operators have little clue as to its inner workings, but they have made a > tremendous impact on the amateur community as a whole. > Why do not expand further on the impact? > While I am not suggesting we attempt to duplicate the success of the TNC, > I believe we would be doing a great service to Amateurs if we developed > some public domain, basic hardware designs that experimenters could rally > around. Of course it is necessary to have a 'core group' for managing the whole project. To start from already available building blocks it should be a good idea. I suppose Hams must become more familiar with 'global systems' instead of 'night time soldering'. Saluti. Stefano From lfry@mindspring.com Tue Feb 11 03:52:25 1997 Received: from mule0.mindspring.com (mule0.mindspring.com [204.180.128.166]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id DAA17111 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 03:52:24 -0600 (CST) Received: from glory (user-168-121-136-107.dialup.mindspring.com [168.121.136.107]) by mule0.mindspring.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id EAA23244; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 04:52:23 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970211095421.00648b44@mindspring.com> X-Sender: lfry@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 04:54:21 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org, beltrani@hawaii.edu From: "Lee W. Fry" Subject: Re: [SS:988] Looking for SS Chipset net sites At 09:56 PM 2/10/97 -0600, Paul wrote: >If you know of a web or FTP site that has such info, I would appreciate it >if you would email me its full url, e.g. >http://www.semi.harris.com/prism.html NOT www.semi.harris. In other >words, I am looking for direct pointers to the information, not general >web sites. > >I will make these sites available from my page at >http://www.pixi.com/~beltrani/ah6nu.htm > I have quite a few direct pointers on my page. The URL is below. Lee W. Fry AA0JP lfry@mindspring.com See my Part 15 Spread Spectrum Device Compendium at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/part15.htm From claudio@cln.it Tue Feb 11 06:39:28 1997 Received: from nausicaa.cln.it (root@nausicaa.cln.it [194.184.28.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id GAA22311 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 06:39:25 -0600 (CST) Received: from claudio ([194.184.28.16]) by nausicaa.cln.it with smtp id m0vuHXA-000WWrC (Debian /\oo/\ Smail3.1.29.1 #29.37); Tue, 11 Feb 97 13:42 MET Message-ID: <33006AC5.2D84@cln.it> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 13:49:09 +0100 From: claudio X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:993] Re: TAPR SS-List Project? References: <33009F2D.6B57@mailbox.nauta.it> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Stefano Coccon wrote: > > I suppose Hams must become more familiar with 'global systems' instead > of 'night > time soldering'. > > Saluti. Stefano - ciao ti interessi anche tu di SS ? hai già fatto qualche esperienza o come me che sto ancora cercando di capire la potenzialità del sistema. ciao Claudio _____________________________ | Claudio Ceravolo (IW5CEI) | Email claudio@cln.it | --------------------------- From lylej@azstarnet.com Tue Feb 11 08:43:24 1997 Received: from mailhost.azstarnet.com (mailhost.azstarnet.com [169.197.1.8]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id IAA27108 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 08:43:23 -0600 (CST) Received: from tomswift (usr7ip7.azstarnet.com [169.197.8.7]) by mailhost.azstarnet.com (8.8.3-p/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA15227 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 07:37:53 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970211073644.006f2180@pop.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: lylej@pop.azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 07:41:55 -0700 To: ss@tapr.org From: Lyle Johnson Subject: Re: [SS:990] Re: Harris Prism chip Set Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Jeff, We got the eval set back in December at work. We hope to get it fired up this week :-( It consuists of a pair of PCMCIA cards, no antennas (not certified...), a set of software to exchange data under DOS (might be windows) and gather statistics, etc. We also have a guy from Harris coming to our office who is supposed to bne pretty knowledgable on the PRISM chip set sometime in the next week or so. We have looked at the ATMEL chipset (a non-starter, basically only good for cordless phones). There are other firms out there with a number of other soluitons, but none seem as comprehensive as PRISM. I'll post some results of our testing here when we get some results :-) Cheers, Lyle At 10:22 PM 2/10/97 -0600, you wrote: >At 06:02 PM 2/10/97 -0600, Bernie Doehner wrote: > >>Hi Scott: >> >>Harris will be coming by our lab on friday with a set of their PCMCIA >>cards. Ask me again next week! >> >>Bernie >> > >Is this the 'PRISM PC Card Wireless LAN'? In the ap note it wasn't clear >if this was a ISA design or a PCMCIA design. It uses the AM79C930 MAC >processor. > >Anyone have one of these beasties yet? Lyle, did you? How much are the >eval units going for... I think the eval unit is a two board set with >WIN95 drivers. > >-Jeff wb8wka > > From ScottE@ix.netcom.com Tue Feb 11 10:39:59 1997 Received: from dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.11]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id KAA03491 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 10:39:57 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id KAA20724 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 10:39:22 -0600 (CST) Received: from den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com(207.92.178.102) by dfw-ix11.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id sma020377; Tue Feb 11 10:39:21 1997 Received: by den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BC17FF.431C78D0@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com>; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:37:56 -0700 Message-ID: <01BC17FF.431C78D0@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com> From: Scott Elliott To: "'SS'" Subject: Project? Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:37:52 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have some thoughts on doing a SS project with the Harris reference = design. 1. A known good design with known good hardware is available. 2. Harris has plans to OEM the PCMCIA cards. They have no interest in = supporting a mass of uneducated end users, but they might be receptive = to an organization of hams (TAPR?) ordering and self-supporting them. = Harris has put a lot of effort to make Prism succeed and if presented = properly Harris should be able to be educated that supporting Hams is in = their best interest. At OEM prices the system could be very low cost. 3. Laying-out an ISA card from the reference should be straight = forward. It should be kept in mind that any custom hardware that is = done at these frequence (part 15) must be tested for FCC type approval = and given the RFI that a bad design could radiate a Part 97 design = should be tested. Hopefully donated test time could be found. Given = the fine pitch of the chips assembly of these boards will not be a = Saturday afternoon kind of thing. A commercial assembly house may have = to be used. I might be able find the time to design this board. 4. The fly in the ointment is the AMD Am79C930 media Access Controller = (MAC). AMD has drivers for Xircom's Netwave and 802.11. Source code is = available for several operating systems. I've had little chance to dig = into the spec sheet (160 pages from their web site www.amd.com) but I = assume that AX.25 could map into one of the supported frames with little = pain. Scott Elliott - KB0ZOE From mackel@hotmail.com Tue Feb 11 11:01:58 1997 Received: from f13.hotmail.com (F13.hotmail.com [207.82.250.24]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id LAA04286 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 11:01:56 -0600 (CST) Received: (from root@localhost) by f13.hotmail.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA00506; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:01:55 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:01:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199702111701.JAA00506@f13.hotmail.com> Received: from 194.236.75.185 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:01:55 PST From: "Marcel Bos" To: ss@tapr.org Subject: The Quest:Ethernet Tbase2 Hw-media standard?! Content-Type: text/plain Wonder. What is Ethernet? Whats Inside that RG58 cable.. what would that signal be/look like on a spectrum scope? Can I perhaps modulate a transmitter with it? Any old projects with this? --------------------------------------------------------- Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------- From mackel@hotmail.com Tue Feb 11 11:05:13 1997 Received: from f27.hotmail.com ([207.82.250.38]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id LAA04691 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 11:05:12 -0600 (CST) Received: (from root@localhost) by f27.hotmail.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) id JAA00105; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:05:11 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:05:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199702111705.JAA00105@f27.hotmail.com> Received: from 194.236.75.185 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 09:05:11 PST From: "Marcel Bos" To: ss@tapr.org Subject: The Quest:Ethernet Tbase2 Hw-media standard?! Content-Type: text/plain Wonder. What is Ethernet? Whats Inside that RG58 cable.. what would that signal be/look like on a spectrum scope? Can I perhaps modulate a transmitter with it? Any old projects with this? --------------------------------------------------------- Get Your *Web-Based* Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --------------------------------------------------------- From hwm@netcom.com Tue Feb 11 15:03:01 1997 Received: from mm.wd6dod.ampr.org (hwm@netcom3.netcom.com [192.100.81.103]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id PAA15177 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 15:02:47 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (by mm.wd6dod.ampr.org (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id NAA00251 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 13:06:13 -0800 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 13:06:13 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Lorenzini To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:997] Project? In-Reply-To: <01BC17FF.431C78D0@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 11 Feb 1997, Scott Elliott wrote: > I have some thoughts on doing a SS project with the Harris reference design. > > > Scott Elliott - KB0ZOE This sounds very attractive. I'am assuming your refering to the 900mhz band and I'am hopeing we could acheive the 1 watt power level even if that meant an outboard amp to the pcmcia card. Bob - wd6dod From ScottE@ix.netcom.com Tue Feb 11 16:58:01 1997 Received: from dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id QAA21335 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 16:57:59 -0600 (CST) Received: from den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com (den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com [207.92.178.102]) by dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com (8.6.13/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA23922 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 14:57:26 -0800 Received: by den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BC1834.13A49350@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com>; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 15:56:00 -0700 Message-ID: <01BC1834.13A49350@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com> From: Scott Elliott To: "'ss@tapr.org'" Subject: RE: 1000] Re: Project? Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 15:55:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BC1834.13A92730" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC1834.13A92730 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob, The Harris set works on 2.45 GHz not 800 MHz. Scott ---------- From: Bob Lorenzini Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 1997 2:05 PM To: ss@tapr.org Subject: [SS:1000] Re: Project? On Tue, 11 Feb 1997, Scott Elliott wrote: > I have some thoughts on doing a SS project with the Harris reference design. > > > Scott Elliott - KB0ZOE This sounds very attractive. I'am assuming your refering to the 900mhz band and I'am hopeing we could acheive the 1 watt power level even if that meant an outboard amp to the pcmcia card. Bob - wd6dod ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC1834.13A92730 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgAWAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYA9AAAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAANQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAHNzQHRhcHIub3JnAFNN VFAAc3NAdGFwci5vcmcAAAAAHgACMAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAAAwAAABzc0B0YXBy Lm9yZwADABUMAQAAAAMA/g8GAAAAHgABMAEAAAAOAAAAJ3NzQHRhcHIub3JnJwAAAAIBCzABAAAA EQAAAFNNVFA6U1NAVEFQUi5PUkcAAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAI5 JAEEgAEAFwAAAFJFOiAxMDAwXSBSZTogUHJvamVjdD8AVgYBBYADAA4AAADNBwIACwAPADcANwAC AGABASCAAwAOAAAAzQcCAAsADwA3AAYAAgAvAQEJgAEAIQAAAEY0MkMwNTEzMkQ4NEQwMTE4MjNE MDBBMDI0Qzk0MURCAO8GAQOQBgBMBAAAFAAAAAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAA AAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAsLLIvG4YvAEeAHAAAQAAABcAAABSRTogMTAwMF0gUmU6IFByb2plY3Q/ AAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABvBhuvLYTBSz1hC0R0II9AKAkyUHbAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAA AB4AHwwBAAAAFQAAAFNjb3R0RUBpeC5uZXRjb20uY29tAAAAAAMABhA8g7gGAwAHEKIBAAAeAAgQ AQAAAGUAAABCT0IsVEhFSEFSUklTU0VUV09SS1NPTjI0NUdIWk5PVDgwME1IWlNDT1RULS0tLS0t LS0tLUZST006Qk9CTE9SRU5aSU5JU0VOVDpUVUVTREFZLEZFQlJVQVJZMTEsMTk5NzI6AAAAAAIB CRABAAAAvwIAALsCAAAYBQAATFpGdUVQTwz/AAoBDwIVAqQD5AXrAoMAUBMDVAIAY2gKwHNldO4y BgAGwwKDMgPGBxMCgyIzD3poZWwDIERs6mcCgzQTDX0KgAjPCdniOxefMjU1AoAKgQ2xwQtgbmcx MDMUIAsKCxLyDAFjAEAgQm9iliwKhQqFVBTwIEgKwKcFEAQgEfEgdwWwawQgAQIgIDIuNDUgRyBI eiBubwVAODDWMAXQH4AuHMxTBaACQGMczAr0bGkxH/ECAGnwLTE0NA3wDNAjgwtZbDE2CqADYHQF kAVALV8lpwqHJFsMMCUmRgNhOs8mriUmDIIcciBMBbAJ8Pp6C4BpJk8nXQZgAjAojwUpm1QKUHNk YXksISgwZWJydQrAeSCEMTEvwDE5OTcfEGQ6MB9QUE0rPyddVG5vLX8pmwQQQAGQJSAujQWwZzF/ LE51YmolYcMznymbW1NTOhrAIABqXQfwZTiQUANgOFI/8yGvIrMzNiQnFcIMASUm/RzMTwOgL1Ew kRxgL+Ewo1MvwCFTIEUVEGlBIneFJTI6HMw+IEkgEcCadh3AcwNwHcB0aAhgSGdodB7TZG8LgGd8 IGEGAAXwJSE4Uh6AaW9EAEPxHccXoGYEkAnwY+cdwA2wAJBnbiBmQyBCtwdJEEK3QQwtIEtCMPha T0UKhR0mSRAdoB4iuQhgbmQEIEOAMEFhAkBScgDQdGlDgC5DMCdMYW1FEAQQdW1E4nmnCGFG5ETi dG9GMzkgAKhtaHoKhWIAcGRFEKdRMU4TRBBwZUTidx3A+QWgdWxRQRGwUiBDgUZCbRxgd01RRWBv UnAFwGz+ZUOAAyBUoQOgBpBD8U1QfwqFB4AAcAVAA5EIYAJQbxMLEUUQbXBPxnBjbX5jBzBSkAsR IG0qYkqwd/RkNkTAZBzMPE8kJxvVCz5dFsEAXnAAAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAEAABzDQc9Kfbhi8 AUAACDDQc9Kfbhi8AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAAAAAAAwANNP03AABMJQ== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC1834.13A92730-- From jeff@mich.com Tue Feb 11 18:52:23 1997 Received: from server1.mich.com (root@server1.mich.com [198.108.16.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id SAA25958; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 18:52:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from gw-aerodata.mich.com (gw-aerodata.mich.com [198.108.16.240]) by server1.mich.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id TAA10269; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 19:56:01 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970212005203.00708468@mail.mich.com> X-Sender: jeff@mail.mich.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 19:52:03 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: Jeff King Subject: SS Eval board pricing Cc: ss-sta@tapr.org So far, the only pricing I recieved is for the PRISM chip set from Harris. This is a 1-4megabit DSSS 2.45mhz chipset doing 100-250mw. The PRISMEVAL-1 includes two radios with extender boards (PCMCIA) and software for $1395. A standard SMA connector is included which of course means its not a Part 15 device (but would comply with the STA I assume). They also have another (similar) eval unit without the extender for $995. The antenna on this one is intergral so it may be of less interest. This also has two units with the kit. I believe the PRISM1EVAL is the same kit a number on here already have. Look forward to your reports. I'm trying to get one now. BTW, the parts of the chipset might be useful with Randy Roberts project. Specifically, the LNA, amp, T/R switch and maybe the upconverter. Regards, ------------------------------------ | Jeff King Aero Data Systems | | jeff@mich.com P.O. Box 510895 | | (810)471-1787 Livonia, MI 48151 | |F(810)471-0279 United States | ------------------------------------ From n3jly@erols.com Tue Feb 11 19:31:55 1997 Received: from smtp1.erols.com ([205.252.116.101]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id TAA27564 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 19:31:53 -0600 (CST) Received: from LOCALNAME (col-as5s21.erols.com [207.172.73.21]) by smtp1.erols.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA21560 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 20:32:15 -0500 Date: Tue, 11 Feb 1997 20:32:15 -0500 Message-Id: <199702120132.UAA21560@smtp1.erols.com> X-Sender: n3jly@pop.erols.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: Tony McConnell Subject: SS of course Hello, What are the charactoristics or design goals that we should be seeking to meet in planning a SS system? How fast? How far, with what power? What immunity? Tony McConnell N3JLI From ddennis@metronet.com Tue Feb 11 21:55:08 1997 Received: from metronet.com (root@fohnix.metronet.com [192.245.137.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA04784 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 21:55:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal46.metronet.com by metronet.com with SMTP id AA05756 (5.67a/IDA1.5hp for ); Tue, 11 Feb 1997 21:47:00 -0600 Received: by dal46.metronet.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BC1865.1E892840@dal46.metronet.com>; Tue, 11 Feb 1997 21:47:04 -0600 Message-Id: <01BC1865.1E892840@dal46.metronet.com> From: David Dennis To: "'ss@tapr.org'" Subject: RE: 982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set Date: Mon, 10 Feb 1997 21:52:14 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: Scott Elliott[SMTP:ScottE@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Mon, February 10, 1997 6:01 PM To: 'ss@tapr.org' Subject: RE: 982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set I seem to remember that they do have their reference design sans the = 802.11 MAC in a PCMCIA form factor. Without the MAC the card is, of = course, not PCMCIA compatible. What you get out of it is just a bit = stream. They also have a demo board for each chip. I suppose that you = would just jumper all the boards together and fire it up. Scott KB0ZOE _________________________________________________________________________= __________________________________ I hate to admit my ignorance in front of so many people, but I'm not = familiar with IEEE 802.11. What exactly does it define? From jphilip@ibm.net Wed Feb 12 07:08:18 1997 Received: from out1.ibm.net (out1.ibm.net [165.87.194.252]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id HAA04363 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 07:08:16 -0600 (CST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by out1.ibm.net (8.6.9/8.6.9) id NAA143889 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:08:14 GMT Received: from slip139-92-17-1.pt.uk.ibm.net(139.92.17.1) by out1.ibm.net via smap (V1.3mjr) id smaMgwDFW; Wed Feb 12 13:08:12 1997 Message-ID: <3301B145.5D98@ibm.net> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:02:13 +0100 From: Jacques PHILIPPE X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: I must be wrong ? References: <3.0.32.19970211073644.006f2180@pop.azstarnet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I read about SS gain. When I made some gain calculations, I cannot believe my results. Lets assume I use FHSS (Frequency Hopping Spread Spectrum) for CW on 10 meters between 28 and 29 MHz with a 100 watts transmitting power. The necessary band for CW is 100 Hz; I spread it over 1MHz gain : 1,000,000/100 = 10,000 -> 40dB Do this means that my spreaded 100 watts will have the same efficiency as 100 * 10,000 = 1,000 KW (one thousand kilowatts ;-) ) of non spreaded power ? I must be wrong somewhere ! Wake me up ;-) ! Yet, I read about GPS ... knowing the GPS satellites travel at 20,000 Km ... and when I look at GPS antenna ... could be true ! Bye de Jacques on4kjp@ibm.net From RLANIER@mailb.harris.com Wed Feb 12 09:40:11 1997 Received: from sol.corp.Harris.COM (sol.corp.harris.com [137.237.104.14]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id JAA11204 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 09:40:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from mailb.harris.com by sol.corp.Harris.COM (8.6.12/Kurts Special version 2.0) id KAA27854; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:40:04 -0500 Received: from ccMail by mailb.harris.com (IMA Internet Exchange 1.04b) id 301e4230; Wed, 12 Feb 97 10:39:15 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:36:49 -0500 Message-ID: <301e4230@mailb.harris.com> From: RLANIER@mailb.harris.com (RLANIER) Subject: Re: [SS:1002] SS Eval board pricing To: ss@tapr.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part >The PRISMEVAL-1 includes two radios with extender boards (PCMCIA) and >software for $1395. A standard SMA connector is included which of >course means its not a Part 15 device (but would comply with the >STA I assume). They also have another (similar) eval unit without >the extender for $995. The antenna on this one is intergral so >it may be of less interest. This also has two units with the >kit. Has anyone checked on getting samples of the PRISM chipset? I was able to obtain 2 sets (without a PWB). Just curious, Tony KE4ATO From ScottE@ix.netcom.com Wed Feb 12 09:58:44 1997 Received: from dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.10]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id JAA11905 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 09:58:43 -0600 (CST) Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id JAA00213 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 09:58:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com(207.92.178.102) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id sma029809; Wed Feb 12 09:57:23 1997 Received: by den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BC18C2.9461A300@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com>; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 08:56:05 -0700 Message-ID: <01BC18C2.9461A300@den-co32-38.ix.netcom.com> From: Scott Elliott To: "'ss@tapr.org'" Subject: RE: 1004] RE: 982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 08:55:54 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BC18C2.946329A0" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC18C2.946329A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ---------- From: David Dennis Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 1997 8:58 PM To: ss@tapr.org Subject: [SS:1004] RE: 982] Re: Harris Prism chip Set I hate to admit my ignorance in front of so many people, but I'm not =3D familiar with IEEE 802.11. What exactly does it define? Davis, 802.11 is much like ethernet, Token bus (802.4) or token ring (802.5). = 802.11 is a new protocol that is intended for the special needs of RF = communication. 802 defines the media access controller (MAC). The MAC = is half of ISO Reference model layer two called the Data Link Layer = (http://munshi.sonoma.edu/s96/bus420/osilecture.html). The other half = of layer two is Link Access Protocol. On a PC this is typically the = ethernet drivers that you install. Another example of a LAP is an AX.25 = type protocol written NJ7P, N7LEM and N7OO (lapa.txt in the tapr FTP = area). For an example of a MAC you can check out = http://www.amd.com/html/overview/corppr/9669.html. Scott KB0ZOE ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC18C2.946329A0 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgUPAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYA9AAAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAANQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAHNzQHRhcHIub3JnAFNN VFAAc3NAdGFwci5vcmcAAAAAHgACMAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAAMwAQAAAAwAAABzc0B0YXBy Lm9yZwADABUMAQAAAAMA/g8GAAAAHgABMAEAAAAOAAAAJ3NzQHRhcHIub3JnJwAAAAIBCzABAAAA EQAAAFNNVFA6U1NAVEFQUi5PUkcAAAAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAI5 JAEEgAEALQAAAFJFOiAxMDA0XSBSRTogOTgyXSBSZTogSGFycmlzIFByaXNtIGNoaXAgU2V0APkM AQWAAwAOAAAAzQcCAAwACAA3ADYAAwBaAQEggAMADgAAAM0HAgAMAAgAEwAHAAMABwEBCYABACEA AABGQjJDMDUxMzJEODREMDExODIzRDAwQTAyNEM5NDFEQgD9BgEDkAYAuAUAABQAAAALACMAAAAA AAMAJgAAAAAACwApAAAAAAADAC4AAAAAAAMANgAAAAAAQAA5ANDPbzr9GLwBHgBwAAEAAAAtAAAA UkU6IDEwMDRdIFJFOiA5ODJdIFJlOiBIYXJyaXMgUHJpc20gY2hpcCBTZXQAAAAAAgFxAAEAAAAW AAAAAbwY/TpPEwUs/IQtEdCCPQCgJMlB2wAAHgAeDAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAB8MAQAAABUA AABTY290dEVAaXgubmV0Y29tLmNvbQAAAAADAAYQaMli3QMABxD9AgAAHgAIEAEAAABlAAAALS0t LS0tLS0tLUZST006REFWSURERU5OSVNTRU5UOlRVRVNEQVksRkVCUlVBUlkxMSwxOTk3ODo1OFBN VE86U1NAVEFQUk9SR1NVQkpFQ1Q6U1M6MTAwNFJFOjk4MlJFOkhBUgAAAAACAQkQAQAAABMEAAAP BAAAnwYAAExaRnVZx6Ht/wAKAQ8CFQKkA+QF6wKDAFATA1QCAGNoCsBzZXQuMgYABsMCgzIPemhl omwDIERsZwKDMwPG6wcTAoM0FK19CoAIzwnZ4jsXnzI1NQKACoENscELYG5nMTAzFJALCmsUkgwB YwBAIAqFCotsEGkxODAC0WktMTw0NA3wDNAeYwtZMTbbCqADYHQFkAVALSCHCofXHzsMMCAGRgNh OiGOIAbDDIIUAGF2aWQUAAnw/QMAcyEvIj0GYAIwI28ke4JUClBzZGF5LCMQEGVicnUKwHkgMQIx KpAxOTk3IDjAOjU4IFBNJg8iPdxUbyhPJHsEEEABkCAAGi4FsGcsTycedWJqhyBBLm8ke1tTUzoa wCgwNF0H8EUzYDk46jI1wWUzYEgKwAUQBCByUDbhbSARsAUgBlF08xyPHZMzNh8HFcIMASAGDEkg EcAgMCB0byBQYWRtaQVAbSsgaWxnbgWwAHBjO1ALgCDjA1ECMCBvZjAwO4ADgVErIHBlbwtQZSqQ Yrp1OuEnN2A8UAVAPQqFPGZhO8AdwArBA/B0aI068EVAwCvAMDIuK0AULiBBcFc7ISBleMkA0HRs KyBkbweRO9HzDbELgGU/OAww/RvUHOzzG28lM3MsOA9GTxxCQQRTPCAEIG11EbAgHcBr/ztQEgAT wASgEgAqkC5AS2CXA6A+kAQgKEECNCk9UD8FwDtwTFIFEBqgTMQ1KbtBYUpYYT8AB9EgAm8XEd87 YEGyNvELgCAwbg2wJYDfAhBNYRPAMDA+EGMHMU+B5wmABCA9YVJGN3ADcErw9QMAYzswaQIgTqRC 5QQg21GyB4BkBzA7kGM8oAQRPwWgAjADYBPgBJBMwE1BekNOklRRwVbBSrIRwGyjPXA9YUlTTzZh ZgSQXwnwPKEEYgMgC2B5VoF0/nc7gFOgVmElgFGyJUABkDQgTAuAa1swWbMoaKECQHA6Ly9TYXM3 kC4uPZA8UADALgmAdS9Qczk2L0yRNAHQL55vAJA+UCBQCHBlLlwA/G1sVvYgIEuxV9dZqDbxvVtD QVWkNyBP9EFhTwOgPU9wUFeQQIBQslTReXB/U5ET4CsgUbJLlkJgBRB2twSQVNJBwXkIYDzBcwGQ uxPgQWFBPxFf0kHxbT5BMz1SWyFBUE8zA6BBWN4uGdBjwjtQT9d3BRACQCFMYU5KN1AqkE43uExF TWihJYBrAE9YgPYoC2BIkC4M0FCRA6BRspswciMQVGhgCsBlYU6Q/Uf8RgWxA5Fne1dyZhJToH8D oBGwBZBbcAhgBUBcBXelceAuP+BkLlMxL17yr14wZXElYAfQLwWhcCAAsi9doDY5XuNt7VMFoAEC QCBLQjBaT0ULSGUWwQB24AADABAQAAAAAAMAERAAAAAAQAAHMCC1Jhf4GLwBQAAIMCC1Jhf4GLwB HgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAAADAA00/TcAAASh ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC18C2.946329A0-- From RLANIER@mailb.harris.com Wed Feb 12 09:58:52 1997 Received: from sol.corp.Harris.COM (sol.corp.harris.com [137.237.104.14]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id JAA11924 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 09:58:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from mailb.harris.com by sol.corp.Harris.COM (8.6.12/Kurts Special version 2.0) id KAA04739; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:58:44 -0500 Received: from ccMail by mailb.harris.com (IMA Internet Exchange 1.04b) id 301e89c0; Wed, 12 Feb 97 10:58:20 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:57:54 -0500 Message-ID: <301e89c0@mailb.harris.com> From: RLANIER@mailb.harris.com (RLANIER) Subject: Re: [SS:987] TAPR SS-List Project? To: ss@tapr.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part >Is there (still) interest in jointly developing some universal SS building >blocks for use by the amateur community? YES!!!! At least I am, anyway. Tony KE4ATO From RLANIER@mailb.harris.com Wed Feb 12 10:02:42 1997 Received: from sol.corp.Harris.COM (sol.corp.harris.com [137.237.104.14]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id KAA12020 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:02:38 -0600 (CST) Received: from mailb.harris.com by sol.corp.Harris.COM (8.6.12/Kurts Special version 2.0) id LAA05732; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:02:32 -0500 Received: from ccMail by mailb.harris.com (IMA Internet Exchange 1.04b) id 301e9780; Wed, 12 Feb 97 11:02:00 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:00:52 -0500 Message-ID: <301e9780@mailb.harris.com> From: RLANIER@mailb.harris.com (RLANIER) Subject: Re: [SS:990] Re: Harris Prism chip Set To: ss@tapr.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part >Is this the 'PRISM PC Card Wireless LAN'? In the ap note it wasn't clear >if this was a ISA design or a PCMCIA design. It uses the AM79C930 MAC >processor. >-Jeff wb8wka Its a PCMCIA design. Its made to plug into a laptop and used as a wireless modem. But I can have other applications, such as amateur uses :) Tony KE4ATO From jeff@mich.com Wed Feb 12 11:18:16 1997 Received: from server1.mich.com (root@server1.mich.com [198.108.16.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id LAA15392 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:18:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from gw-aerodata.mich.com (gw-aerodata.mich.com [198.108.16.240]) by server1.mich.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id MAA01497 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:22:11 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970212171756.006c62a4@mail.mich.com> X-Sender: jeff@mail.mich.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:17:56 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: Jeff King Subject: Re: [SS:1006] Re: SS Eval board pricing At 09:41 AM 2/12/97 -0600, RLANIER wrote: >Has anyone checked on getting >samples of the PRISM chipset? I was >able to obtain 2 sets (without a >PWB). > >Just curious, > >Tony KE4ATO Didn't you just answer your own question? Since you got samples I assume they are available. IBM laid out the board (PWB) for the eval units harris is selling and artwork is not available. However, Harris provides a schematic in Orcad format so you could do it yourself although the assembly due to the small pitch size would not be a kitchen table project. The chip set is sold in 48 unit "tubes" although you can buy the parts individially. The chip set in Q 10,000 is about $52.00 US. -Jeff From beltrani@hawaii.edu Wed Feb 12 12:37:02 1997 Received: from relay1.Hawaii.Edu (root@relay1.Hawaii.Edu [128.171.3.53]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id MAA20190 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:37:00 -0600 (CST) Received: from uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu ([128.171.44.54]) by relay1.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <587128(4)>; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 08:33:28 -1000 Received: from localhost by uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <216699(2)>; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 08:36:48 -1000 Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 08:36:45 -1000 From: Paul A Beltrani X-Sender: beltrani@uhunix4 Reply-To: beltrani@pixi.com To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:988] Looking for SS Chipset net sites In-Reply-To: <2.2.32.19970211095421.00648b44@mindspring.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Mon, 10 Feb 1997, Lee W. Fry wrote: > At 09:56 PM 2/10/97 -0600, Paul wrote: > > >If you know of a web or FTP site that has such info, I would appreciate it > >if you would email me its full url, e.g. >... > >I will make these sites available from my page at > >http://www.pixi.com/~beltrani/ah6nu.htm > > > > I have quite a few direct pointers on my page. The URL is below. > > Lee W. Fry AA0JP > lfry@mindspring.com > See my Part 15 Spread Spectrum Device Compendium at: > http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/part15.htm I looks like I was going to reinvent the wheel. Mr. Fry's page is exactly what I had in mind. In addition, he covers more chips that I was aware of. Definitely worth checking out if your looking for hardware to experiment with. - Paul Beltrani, AH6NU From hansen@fredonia.edu Wed Feb 12 15:18:28 1997 Received: from oak.ait.fredonia.edu (oak.ait.fredonia.edu [141.238.20.4]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id PAA27161 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:18:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from oak.ait.fredonia.edu by oak.ait.fredonia.edu (NTMail 3.02.10) with ESMTP id qa013094 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 16:13:26 +0000 Message-ID: <330233A7.35@fredonia.edu> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 16:18:31 -0500 From: "John A. Hansen" Reply-To: hansen@fredonia.edu Organization: SUNY-Fredonia X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: ABACOM Technologies Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Has anyone heard of ABACOM Technologies? They have an ad in this month's Nuts and Volts. They claim to be selling a data transceiver with an RS-232 interface that will run from 4,800 to 38,800 bps half duplex with .25 mW output on either 418 or 433 MHz for $139.30. They are also advertising a "64 Channel, Synthesized Module" for 2.4 GHz Spread Spectrum at 1 Mbs. No price is given. I tried calling, but got an answering machine. Anybody know anything about these guys? John WA0PTV From lfry@mindspring.com Wed Feb 12 17:41:18 1997 Received: from mule1.mindspring.com (mule1.mindspring.com [204.180.128.167]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA03247 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 17:41:17 -0600 (CST) Received: from glory (user-168-121-136-107.dialup.mindspring.com [168.121.136.107]) by mule1.mindspring.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id SAA126256 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 18:41:13 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970212234253.003296b8@mindspring.com> X-Sender: lfry@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 18:42:53 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: "Lee W. Fry" Subject: Goals Have we lost sight of what our goals need to be? We have a STA that right now is good for 6 months. The STA relieves us of the current rules in 4 areas: Removes the requirement to transmit station identification signals by a CW or phone emission; Permits spread spectrum emissions on amateur radio bands 50-54 MHz, 144-148 MHz, 219-220 MHz and 222-225 MHz; Provides for transmission of hybrid spread spectrum emissions; and Permits the use of other spreading codes. Shouldn't our goal be to demonstrate the practicability of granting a permanent rules change along the lines of the STA? What are we doing that specifically addresses collecting data to support the rules change process? Initial direction was a group buy of 900 MHz devices and a lot of people putting up WLANs using various routers and antennas. Nice useful experience, but what rules change are we addressing? So far all we might be able to claim is that our higher gain (higher than part 15 allows)900 MHz units aren't bothering anybody who isn't bothered already. A lot of people are getting really good TCP/IP networking experience, but that doesn't buy us rule changes. With that said, I'll throw out a couple of suggestions. What about voice comms? No computer, protocol stacks, or arcane networking knowledge needed. Just a CODEC driving the unit and you are on your way. Technology might be easily cobbled from SS cordless phones. I really like the idea of a unit that puts out a nice IF like Robert's design. With transverters we could get up in many different bands and see who we affect. Might even be able to involve some of the weak signal guys who normally use transverters in their designs. If you want to get some idea of what the FCC is going to hear if a NPRM comes out, there was a long bunch of SS related threads on the VHF reflector in late November and early December. I have HTMLized these and put them up at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/SS/SSThread.html. Take a look. It will come down to arguments about the "noise floor". By the way, TCP/IP, or possibly mobile IP or TACO 2 on Linux based routers over a 2.4 GHz 2 Mbps WLAN is my interest, but I'm worried about us getting the Part 97 rules changes needed to enable me play with this on down the line. Lee W. Fry AA0JP lfry@mindspring.com See my Part 15 Spread Spectrum Device Compendium at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/part15.htm From buaas@wireless.wdc.net Wed Feb 12 20:26:29 1997 Received: from wireless.wdc.net (wireless.wdc.net [204.140.136.28]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id UAA10438 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 20:26:27 -0600 (CST) Received: (from buaas@localhost) by wireless.wdc.net (8.8.2/8.6.12) id SAA18280 for ss@tapr.org; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 18:28:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 18:28:30 -0800 (PST) From: "Robert A. Buaas" Message-Id: <199702130228.SAA18280@wireless.wdc.net> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1013] Goals [large, well thought out section snipped] >If you want to get some idea of what the FCC is going to hear if a NPRM >comes out, there was a long bunch of SS related threads on the VHF reflector >in late November and early December. I have HTMLized these and put them up >at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/SS/SSThread.html. Take a look. It >will come down to arguments about the "noise floor". >Lee W. Fry AA0JP Lee-- I completely concur with your last statement. It is unfortunate, because it is particularly this problem that is the most misunderstood by those that would vote against SS. If we are to win the NPRM fight, we MUST field "existance proofs" on the most popular bands (144, 220, 440) that demonstrate that SS is no threat to the existing users. While it's nice to play with 900 and 2.4 Gz commercial systems (which, I admit, provide considerable hands-on performance experience, not to mention high throughput compared to current narrowband modes), going this direction does little toward the goal of getting the STA into the Rules, and getting SS accepted generally. My $.02. best regards to all/bob K6KGS From ddennis@metronet.com Wed Feb 12 21:33:18 1997 Received: from metronet.com (root@mail.metronet.com [192.245.137.6]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA13572 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 21:33:16 -0600 (CST) Received: from dal85.metronet.com by metronet.com with SMTP id AA17525 (5.67a/IDA1.5hp for ); Wed, 12 Feb 1997 21:32:54 -0600 Received: by dal85.metronet.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BC192C.526C0E80@dal85.metronet.com>; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 21:33:01 -0600 Message-Id: <01BC192C.526C0E80@dal85.metronet.com> From: David Dennis To: "'ss@tapr.org'" Subject: RE: 1012] ABACOM Technologies Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 21:18:24 -0600 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ---------- From: John A. Hansen[SMTP:hansen@fredonia.edu] Sent: Wed, February 12, 1997 9:20 AM To: ss@tapr.org Subject: [SS:1012] ABACOM Technologies They are also advertising a "64 Channel, Synthesized Module" for 2.4 GHz Spread Spectrum at 1 Mbs. No price is given. I tried calling, but got an answering machine. Anybody know anything about these guys? John WA0PTV ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The wording on this is strange but 1Mb/s sounds interesting. I'd have to see to believe. From buaas@wireless.net Thu Feb 13 09:47:11 1997 Received: from wireless.net (wireless.net [198.253.254.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id JAA19223 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 09:47:09 -0600 (CST) Received: (from buaas@localhost) by wireless.net (8.7.6/8.6.12) id IAA14027 for ss@tapr.org; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 08:01:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 08:01:36 -0800 (PST) From: "Robert A. Buaas" Message-Id: <199702131601.IAA14027@wireless.net> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Interesting Ph.D. Thesis available Gang-- try reading http://cas.et.tudelft.nl:8080/~glas/thesis and http://cas.et.tudelft.nl:8080/~glas/isssta. The author's home page is at .../~glas. He's a recent Ph.D graduate of the Technical University at Delft (NL), moved here to Bell Labs. These papers are very interesting/informative reading. (Greg: I recommend adding these links to the TAPR/ss Web page) best regards/bob From wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org Thu Feb 13 12:37:26 1997 Received: from wb9mjn.ampr.org (wb9mjn.ampr.org [44.72.98.19]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id MAA28560 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 12:36:33 -0600 (CST) From: wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org Date: Thu, 13 Feb 97 12:20:49 UTC Message-Id: <12803@wb9mjn.ampr.org> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1005] I must be wrong ? In-Reply-To: your message of Wed Feb 12 07:14:56 1997 <3301B145.5D98@ibm.net> Hi Jacques, No, that s not right. The 40 dB processing gain is ur intererance toler- nce in ur case. A broadband noise source would need 1000 KW to have equal ower to the despread FH signal. There is no free ride here. The 100 watt W station has the same communications capability, against natural noise ources as a 100 watt FH CW station with 40 dB processing gain (or any rocessing gain). GPS satellites have a baseband data rate of 9600 baud. So, that s just like a Pacsat station. There are other system parameters, which i could not get right , off the cuff, but suffice it to say, spread and despread, the signals are similar to a 435 Mhz pacsat. 73, Don. Mailbox : WB9MJN @ N9HSI.IL.USA.NA AMPRNet : wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org[44.72.98.19] Internet: wb9mjn%wb9mjn.ampr.org@uugate.aim.utah.edu From arutz@shfmicro.com Thu Feb 13 18:26:03 1997 Received: from alice.adsnet.com (alice.adsnet.com [206.158.2.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id SAA14557 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 18:26:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from pool-001-9.adsnet.com (pool-001-9.adsnet.com [208.4.86.9]) by alice.adsnet.com (8.6.5/8.6.6) with SMTP id SAA14924 for ; Thu, 13 Feb 1997 18:28:48 -0600 Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 18:28:48 -0600 Message-Id: <199702140028.SAA14924@alice.adsnet.com> X-Sender: arutz@mail.adsnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: arutz@shfmicro.com (alan rutz) Subject: 2.4 ghz unit? http://www2.seeder.net.tw/yoyo/PCMCA.htm was something I found this evening. Sorry if this duplicates anyone else's messages, but look it over if you want. It's a 2.4 ghz DSSS PCMCIA card at a reasonable cost. de alan, wa9gka From lfry@mindspring.com Fri Feb 14 19:05:13 1997 Received: from mule0.mindspring.com (mule0.mindspring.com [204.180.128.166]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id TAA24862 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 1997 19:05:11 -0600 (CST) Received: from glory (user-168-121-136-107.dialup.mindspring.com [168.121.136.107]) by mule0.mindspring.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id UAA03306 for ; Fri, 14 Feb 1997 20:05:10 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970215010708.00355044@mindspring.com> X-Sender: lfry@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 14 Feb 1997 20:07:08 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: "Lee W. Fry" Subject: Bounced? My ISP had some mail server problems 2/13 and I found I was bounced off of some lists. Although the listserver tells me I am suscribed, I've seen nothing past [SS:1016]. I am posting this to see if this list was one that bounced me. Thanks for your patience all. AA0JP Lee W. Fry AA0JP lfry@mindspring.com See my Part 15 Spread Spectrum Device Compendium at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/part15.htm From N5RG@aol.com Sat Feb 15 00:35:41 1997 Received: from emout25.mail.aol.com (emout25.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.130]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id AAA15897 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 1997 00:35:39 -0600 (CST) From: N5RG@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by emout25.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id BAA17863 for ss@tapr.org; Sat, 15 Feb 1997 01:35:08 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 1997 01:35:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <970214175459_1314918712@emout19.mail.aol.com> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: V-Link by YES! Entertainment Hello, A couple of weeks ago the first WalMart opened in Boise. My wife and I went over to check it out the second day it was open. Of course one of the first places I visited was the Electronics section. They had quite a few neat and interesting items. One item that caught my eye was a small handheld unit that looked a lot like the smallest of the cellular phones currently available. I started reading the box and became intrigued by the description. Here are some of the specifications: Range: 3 blocks Voice mail: send and/or receive voice mail up to 20 sec in length Display: LCD Addressing: Set your own address and the address of the V-Link unit to call Signal: Either tone or buzzer (when being called) The address of the received station is displayed on the LCD screen Either a private (to addressed station only) or public (everybody) message can be sent. V-LINK emulates the operation of a cellular phone. Price: $69.96. There is no indication on the outside of the box as to what kind of radio this is. It does not say AM, FM, or Spread Spectrum. I asked a WalMart employee to open the box to see what the instructions say. The enclosed instructions did not say what the modulation scheme is or indicate what frequency is used. There does not appear to be a push to talk switch, only an off-low-high switch. The manufacturer is YES! Entertainment Corp. I did some Net Surfing and found that on Dec 20, 1996, YES! had made a deal with the FCC to allow the continued sale of V-LINK. It seems they had started selling V-Link before they had received the FCC certification. They had to pay a $31,000 fine. I also learned that YES! Entertainment is primarily a toy manufacturing Company and that they are marketing the V-LINK to teenagers so they can stay in touch with their friends. I called the 800 number on the box and asked the young lady who answered if she could give me some technical info on the V-LINK. She said it used rf at 900 Mhz and that the system could only handle 20 addresses at the same time. I was told that technical info about the rf portion of V-LINK was company proprietary and she did not think I could get any info about it. So I am now quite curious as to whether or not it uses Spread Spectrum. It seems to be quite a bit smarter than an old fashioned CB or 49 Mhz walkie-talkie. The use of addressing and the public/private feature indicate a fairly high level of smarts to me. If it turns out to actually be a spread spectrum device, won't it be interesting if my first spread spectrum radio was manfactured to be a toy? 73, Roy W7IDM, ex N5RG From lfry@mindspring.com Sat Feb 15 05:17:11 1997 Received: from mule1.mindspring.com (mule1.mindspring.com [204.180.128.167]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id FAA23343 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 1997 05:17:08 -0600 (CST) Received: from glory (user-168-121-136-107.dialup.mindspring.com [168.121.136.107]) by mule1.mindspring.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id GAA65602 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 1997 06:17:04 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970215111914.0034dc5c@mindspring.com> X-Sender: lfry@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 15 Feb 1997 06:19:14 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: "Lee W. Fry" Subject: Re: [SS:1020] V-Link by YES! Entertainment At 12:39 AM 2/15/97 -0600, Roy, W7IDM wrote: >So I am now quite curious as to whether or not it uses Spread Spectrum. >It seems to be quite a bit smarter than an old fashioned CB or 49 Mhz >walkie-talkie. The use of addressing and the public/private feature >indicate a fairly high level of smarts to me. > They're not Spread Spectrum. The scanner buffs figured this one out real quickly. A quick Deja News search turns up the following post by "Robert H. Eisner" to rec.radio.scanner: Begin Quoted Message--------------- Subject: Re: V-Link From: "Robert H. Eisner" Date: 1997/02/06 Message-Id: <32FA978C.6DBE@worldnet.att.net> References: <01bc149d$12d06700$6d7c48a6@IBM.IBM.NET> To: Jim Murray Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-Ascii Organization: AT&T WorldNet Service Mime-Version: 1.0 Reply-To: rheisner@worldnet.att.net Newsgroups: rec.radio.scanner X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) Jim Murray wrote: > > Anybody got any info on the new Vlink system that WalMart is pushing? The following is a list of frequencies for the new V-Link phones from "YES! Entertainment Corp". The Phones (Walkie-Talkies) run around $70 and can be purchased at Toys R US, WalMart and EBX stores. An optional Nicad Battery with Charger can also be purchased for an additional $30. 916.8750 Calling Channel 1 (Main/Home Frequency) 915.8625 Calling Channel 2 915.0000 Calling Channel 3 914.0875 Calling Channel 4 913.3375 Calling Channel 5 912.0000 Calling Channel 6 910.9125 Calling Channel 7 910.2375 Calling Channel 8 909.3375 Calling Channel 9 908.5000 Calling Channel 10 907.6625 Calling Channel 11 907.0000 Calling Channel 12 906.3375 Calling Channel 13 905.6625 Calling Channel 14 904.5000 Calling Channel 15 904.0000 Calling Channel 16 903.4875 Calling Channel 17 903.0000 Calling Channel 18 902.5000 Calling Channel 19 I obtained a set from Toys R US and found that they're using 916.875 Mhz for the main calling freuquency. The units seem to switch to another freuquency only if you two party lines were active at the same time. If you place the phones in Private mode, they switch frequencies once a link has been established between two phones. The phones do not appear to be using DCS or CTCSS. I've also noticed that if a link goes inactive (you haven't keyed the link switch for over 10 seconds) the units get lost, and unless both parties hit the clear switch, there doesn't appear to be away for the two parties to establish another connection. They also have a maximum range of 1000 feet at best! (NOT 3 blocks!) For the money that you will be paying, I would recomend an FRS radio from Motorola or Midland. Bob End Quoted Message---------- Also, WA1YKL posted: Begin Quoted Message---------- ubject: Re: V-tech kid phones From: "sdonnell@nh" Date: 1996/11/30 Message-Id: <329FBF78.1B14@ultranet.nh.com> References: <575727$ib8@dfw-Ixnews5.ix.netcom.com> <57ni39$sp7@relay.ttc.com> To: Bryan Crider Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-Ascii Organization: www.nh.ultranet.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: rec.radio.scanner,alt.radio.scanner X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01 (Win95; U) The V-Link phones as they are called are a very interesting form of "kiddie talkie". I suspect these could be intended to compete directly with UHF FRS radios. We got one the other day and played with it quite a bit. Yes, 916.875 MHz is their calling/standby freq. They also have 15 other channels on freqs all the way down to 903.48 Mhz that they use on an as needed basis for "private" links and depending on other users/interference on the other CHs. They use good ol analog Wide FM (25 KHz deviation) for voice transmission. CTCSS/DCS is not used for selective(private) calling. Instead, they have a high speed digital ANI code burst that is sent at the beginning of an initaial transmission and anytime the CH remanins inactive for 10 seconds or so. The ANI data burst is apparently how the units instruct others as to what freq to switch to for private conversations.Hardly all too private though...One cute feature they have is digital voice storage, to save messages when the user is not available. I wonder if these might become popualr with certain drug gangs... The transmit power level from the V-Link is only about .2 milliwatts, so I can't say they the reported "3 blocks" range is not streching it a bit far. Being a licensed Amateur, I have the option of removing the hardwired antenna and replacing it with an SMA receptical to permit attaching it to better antennas and or amplifiers 73s DE WA1YKL End Quoted Message---------- Lee W. Fry AA0JP lfry@mindspring.com See my Part 15 Spread Spectrum Device Compendium at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/part15.htm From N5RG@aol.com Sat Feb 15 10:05:51 1997 Received: from emout08.mail.aol.com (emout08.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.23]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id KAA04115 for ; Sat, 15 Feb 1997 10:05:49 -0600 (CST) From: N5RG@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by emout08.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id LAA18271 for ss@tapr.org; Sat, 15 Feb 1997 11:05:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 15 Feb 1997 11:05:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <970215110517_1678469813@emout08.mail.aol.com> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1021] Re: V-Link by YES! Entertainment Lee: Thank you very much for your quick reply to my query about the V-LINK radio. I can now stop worrying about what they are. 73, Roy W7IDM, ex N5RG > They're not Spread Spectrum. The scanner buffs figured this one out real > quickly. A quick Deja News search turns up the following post by "Robert H. > Eisner" to rec.radio.scanner: > From taylord@ecn.purdue.edu Mon Feb 17 09:51:09 1997 Received: from atom.ecn.purdue.edu (root@atom.ecn.purdue.edu [128.46.132.94]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id JAA14562 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 09:51:07 -0600 (CST) Received: from [128.46.169.162] (instru1.ecn.purdue.edu [128.46.169.162]) by atom.ecn.purdue.edu (8.8.5/3.8.2moyman) with ESMTP id KAA17482; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 10:50:56 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 1997 10:50:56 -0500 (EST) X-Sender: taylord@128.46.169.94 Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: David G Taylor Subject: SS data acq review article It's been a quiet week at Lake SS..... In the Feb 97 Personal Engineering & Instrumentation News, the cover spotlight is on SS, including a lengthy article describing the technology and challenges in using wireless data links. Hardware includes modems and LANs, DS and FH, 900 & 2400 MHz. The issue is sprinkled with ads from the manufactering players...... ---- 73 de David KB9KNS (Am cordless; will travel.) --taylord@ecn.purdue.edu From fred@astro.wnmu.edu Mon Feb 17 18:08:46 1997 Received: from a202.wnmu.edu ([198.59.153.202]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id SAA11388 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 18:08:33 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fred@localhost) by a202.wnmu.edu (8.7.1/8.6.9) id SAA01385 for ss@tapr.org; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 18:30:13 -0700 From: Fred Treasure Message-Id: <199702180130.SAA01385@a202.wnmu.edu> Subject: FreeWave To: ss@tapr.org Date: Mon, 17 Feb 1997 18:30:12 -0700 (MST) Content-Type: text I purchased two FreeWave 915 MHz SS transceivers to evaluate under the STA. While they were not a bargain compared to the (failed) TAPR purchase, they are still a very good deal in terms of performance for the dollar. The transceivers have a number of very useful link diagnostics built into them, including: 1. Noise level measurement. 2. Signal level measurement. 3. Percentage of packets received. 4. Number of disconnects. The units can also operate in a continuous 'ping' mode. This allowed me to set up one end of the link as a reference node. I could then drive around with the other transceiver plugged into the cigar lighter. The unit show via the front panel LEDs when the link is connected and by the brightness of one of the LEDs the link quality. No computer or any other test equipment is required. This feature made path testing a pleasure. As a real-world test I replaced an existing 42 kilometer 9600 bps 440 MHz link with the FreeWaves. The path is difficult because it does not have a line-of-sight path. The 9600 link was marginal. The FreeWaves running at 115,200 bps work fine. This is very impressive performance. It should be noted that these units did not interfere with the existing 440 voice repeater at the same site. Likewise they created no problems with our 440 and 145 packet gear. The FreeWaves were not affected by the 10 kilowatt commercial FM station on the same tower. I had hoped to run more tests with the units but they seem to have found a permanent home replacing the 9600 bps link. I'm saving my money for another pair to try on a even longer line-of-sight path... Fred Treasure, KE5CI sysop@astro.wnmu.edu From hwm@netcom.com Mon Feb 17 20:47:55 1997 Received: from mm.wd6dod.ampr.org (hwm@netcom5.netcom.com [192.100.81.113]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id UAA18513 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 20:47:45 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (by mm.wd6dod.ampr.org (8.7.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA00388 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 18:38:14 -0800 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 1997 18:38:14 -0800 (PST) From: Bob Lorenzini To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1024] FreeWave In-Reply-To: <199702180130.SAA01385@a202.wnmu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII >I purchased two FreeWave 915 MHz SS transceivers to evaluate under the >STA. >While they were not a bargain compared to the (failed) TAPR purchase, >they are still a very good deal in terms of performance for the dollar. Are we talking ~$1300@ here ? Bob - wd6dod From fred@astro.wnmu.edu Mon Feb 17 22:27:59 1997 Received: from a202.wnmu.edu ([198.59.153.202]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id WAA25028 for ; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 22:27:42 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fred@localhost) by a202.wnmu.edu (8.7.1/8.6.9) id WAA02020 for ss@tapr.org; Mon, 17 Feb 1997 22:49:24 -0700 From: Fred Treasure Message-Id: <199702180549.WAA02020@a202.wnmu.edu> Subject: Re: [SS:1025] Re: FreeWave To: ss@tapr.org Date: Mon, 17 Feb 1997 22:49:23 -0700 (MST) In-Reply-To: from "Bob Lorenzini" at Feb 17, 97 08:48:37 pm Content-Type: text > > >I purchased two FreeWave 915 MHz SS transceivers to evaluate under the > >STA. > >While they were not a bargain compared to the (failed) TAPR purchase, > >they are still a very good deal in terms of performance for the dollar. > > Are we talking ~$1300@ here ? > > Bob - wd6dod > > Yes. sigh. Fred From karn@unix.ka9q.ampr.org Tue Feb 18 03:56:31 1997 Received: from unix.ka9q.ampr.org (unix.ka9q.ampr.org [129.46.90.35]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id DAA15349 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 03:56:29 -0600 (CST) Received: (from karn@localhost) by unix.ka9q.ampr.org (8.7.4/8.7.3) id BAA09240 for ss@tapr.org; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 01:56:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 1997 01:56:19 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199702180956.BAA09240@unix.ka9q.ampr.org> From: Phil Karn To: ss@tapr.org Reply-To: karn@qualcomm.com In-reply-to: <12803@wb9mjn.ampr.org> Subject: Re: [SS:1017] Re: I must be wrong ? > GPS satellites have a baseband data rate of 9600 baud. So, that s just like No, GPS satellites have a baseband data rate of 50 bps for the navigation message. That yields a pretty healthy processing gain of 1023000 / 50 = 43.1 dB against uncorrelated interference. Some of this processing gain is "used up" by multiple access interference from the other satellites in view. E.g., if you have 6 satellites in view at the same time and they're all arriving with equal strength (a simplifying assumption that isn't generally true) you lose 10*log10(6-1) ~= 7 dB in SNR due to CDMA interference. But that still leaves you with a whopping 36.1 dB SNR, ignoring thermal noise. Still, this probably explains why so many cheap GPS receivers can get away with multiplexing their channels instead of having true parallel channels. Phil From neven@lucy.spct.net Tue Feb 18 09:19:42 1997 Received: from lucy.spct.net (lucy.spct.net [207.86.226.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id JAA26926 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 09:19:32 -0600 (CST) Received: from lale (lale.spct.net [207.86.226.10]) by lucy.spct.net (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA08988 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 17:19:33 +0200 Message-Id: <1.5.4.16.19970218161815.0bbf728e@lucy.spct.net> X-Sender: neven@lucy.spct.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Feb 1997 17:18:15 +0100 To: ss@tapr.org From: Neven Dilkov Subject: Re: [SS:1026] Re: FreeWave Fred, or someone else: At 10:30 PM 2/17/97 -0600, you wrote: >> >I purchased two FreeWave 915 MHz SS transceivers to evaluate under the >> >STA. >> >While they were not a bargain compared to the (failed) TAPR purchase, >> >they are still a very good deal in terms of performance for the dollar. >> How difficult is to get the output of the FreeWave transceiver and convert it to the 2.4GHz band? The 900Mhz is licensed here in Bulgaria and I can't use it.. The other commercial products working at 2.4GHz are prohibitively expensive for me. Any info would be greatly appreciated... Neven & Vesco (LZ3CQ) From fred@astro.wnmu.edu Tue Feb 18 12:00:38 1997 Received: from a202.wnmu.edu ([198.59.153.202]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id MAA04418 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 12:00:25 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fred@localhost) by a202.wnmu.edu (8.7.1/8.6.9) id MAA04565 for ss@tapr.org; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 12:22:17 -0700 From: Fred Treasure Message-Id: <199702181922.MAA04565@a202.wnmu.edu> Subject: Re: [SS:1028] Re: FreeWave To: ss@tapr.org Date: Tue, 18 Feb 1997 12:22:16 -0700 (MST) In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19970218161815.0bbf728e@lucy.spct.net> from "Neven Dilkov" at Feb 18, 97 09:24:16 am Content-Type: text > > How difficult is to get the output of the FreeWave transceiver and convert > it to the 2.4GHz band? > The 900Mhz is licensed here in Bulgaria and I can't use it.. The other > commercial products working at 2.4GHz are prohibitively expensive for me. Hello Neven and Vesco, I don't think that would work. Other spread spectrum devices such as WaveLAN cards that have versions for 2.4 GHz might be a better choice. If you need a good source of information take a look at http://hydra/carleton.ca/info/wlan.html Speaking of expensive, the FreeWave transceivers are $1300 each. A WaveLAN 2.4 GHz channel B card for use outside of the U.S.A. is $795. Take a look at the http site and see if anything there meets your needs. My experience has been with FreeWave, Wavelan and Proxim 915 MHz units. I don't have any practical knowledge about the 2.4 GHz devices. Thank you for taking the time to write and let me know if I can be of further assistance. Best Regards, Fred From javincent@iee.org Tue Feb 18 14:31:05 1997 Received: from gate.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk (firewall-user@gate.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk [193.63.247.66]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id OAA12165 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 14:30:56 -0600 (CST) Received: by gate.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk; id AA19452; Tue, 18 Feb 97 20:31:33 GMT Message-Id: <9702182031.AA19452@gate.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk> Received: from gw.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk(193.63.243.2) by gate.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk via smap (3.2) id xma019435; Tue, 18 Feb 97 20:30:56 GMT Received: from vincent.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk by gw.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk with SMTP; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 20:29:58 GMT Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "James A Vincent" To: ss@tapr.org Date: Tue, 18 Feb 1997 20:29:21 0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: Spread Spectrum Design Reply-To: javincent@iee.org Priority: normal X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.42a) I have been following the discussion on the TAPR bulk purchase of Freewave SS modules. I feel that the withdrawal of the offer to supply these units to TAPR should be viewed positively, as it should hopefully encourage interested amateurs to focus on non-proprietary SS designs . A few years ago, I designed and built a 1W direct sequence transmitter and receiver which operated at 435 MHz with BPSK modulation (8 MHz mainlobe bandwidth) and 32 kBits/s delta-modulated voice. A companion receiver utilised a delay locked loop to recover the SS signal. I decided that the best design approach was to use standard components which were readily available (as far as possible with rf components !) and use a modular approach to the design. This resulted in a system which could be readily modified and permit experimentation with different architectures as my knowledge of SS increased and new devices became available. The system was not "state-of-the-art" and consisted of many die-cast boxes rather than a single PCMIA card. However, the components were relatively easy to find and experimentation was possible as all sub-system modules could be modified (unlike commercial implementations). This design was published in the UK journal Electronics and Wireless World (Voice Link over Spread Spectrum Radio, James Vincent, September and October 1993) and in Randy Robert's Spread Spectrum Scene Magazine (see www.sss-mag.com). I would like to propose that the SIG should focus their skills into producing a modular SS system (either ds, fh or even a hybrid) using standard digital "glue" logic components (e.g. HC/AC TTL logic families) and common rf components such as (for example) the Philips/Signetics NE605 series and Mini-Circuits mixers and MAR mmics. I feel that such an approach would allow individuals to more easily understand SS concepts and circuits whilst promoting flexibility in SS system design and allow an amateur standard(s) to evolve. I fear that the adoption of a US commercial standard (using specific US FCC frequency allocations and proprietary architectures) would stifle rf experimentation and make it extremely difficult for amateur SS techniques to be adopted internationally. James Vincent G1PVZ From rlanier@su102s.ess.harris.com Tue Feb 18 16:26:31 1997 Received: from ess.harris.com (su15a.ess.harris.com [130.41.1.251]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id QAA18587 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 16:26:30 -0600 (CST) Received: from losalamos.ess.harris.com (su102s.ess.harris.com [130.41.13.101]) by ess.harris.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA09709 for ; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 17:26:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from Paris.GASD102designcenter by losalamos.ess.harris.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA26682; Tue, 18 Feb 97 17:26:25 EST Received: by Paris.GASD102designcenter (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA06559; Tue, 18 Feb 1997 17:26:21 -0500 Date: Tue, 18 Feb 1997 17:26:21 -0500 From: rlanier@su102s.ess.harris.com (Tony Lanier) Message-Id: <199702182226.RAA06559@Paris.GASD102designcenter> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1030] Spread Spectrum Design X-Sun-Charset: US-ASCII > This design was published in the UK > journal Electronics and Wireless World (Voice Link over Spread > Spectrum Radio, James Vincent, September and October 1993) and in > Randy Robert's Spread Spectrum Scene Magazine (see > www.sss-mag.com). > > I would like to propose that the SIG should focus their skills > into producing a modular SS system (either ds, fh or even a > hybrid) using standard digital "glue" logic components (e.g. > HC/AC TTL logic families) and common rf components such as (for > example) the Philips/Signetics NE605 series and Mini-Circuits > mixers and MAR mmics. > > I feel that such an approach would allow individuals to more > easily understand SS concepts and circuits whilst promoting > flexibility in SS system design and allow an amateur standard(s) > to evolve. I fear that the adoption of a US commercial standard > (using specific US FCC frequency allocations and proprietary > architectures) would stifle rf experimentation and make it > extremely difficult for amateur SS techniques to be adopted > internationally. > > James Vincent G1PVZ > I have been thinking about the best possible route for this SS project. I have to agree with James. His modular approach is the same thing I was discussing last week. His article was pretty informative. I learned about using 3-db pad attenuators in RF circuit design, something that some hams don't think twice about. As to the PRISM chipset (or any chipset) approach, the frequencies involved would cause more headaches than its worth, at least right now. Since we only have 6 months, we don't have time to fret over such matters. And why should we use a chipset only to turn around and develop something else from scratch? James' proposal brings up another point that we have been discuss- ing: which frequency(ies) to use. This is certain to open a can of worms, especially with the repeater guys, weak signal, etc. I think the best thing to do is use a top-down, modular, block format: have an rf section, which can drop into the system and use whatever frequecy(ies) you want; a mod/demod section, preferably using a DSP or programmable logic; an FEC section; and a interface section, using RS232/RS422 and audio outputs/inputs. One thing TAPR could do is develop a set of standards for amateur SS experientation: how to spread/despread, how much bandwidth to use in certain frequency bands, post source code for the DSP, etc. I believe that the modular approach, with guidance from TAPR, is the best experimental approach we can make. Anyone like to comment? Tony KE4ATO From ssampson@claven.tinker.af.mil Wed Feb 19 08:54:41 1997 Received: from othello.tinker.af.mil (othello.tinker.af.mil [137.240.231.43]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id IAA12416 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 1997 08:54:34 -0600 (CST) Received: from loopback by othello.tinker.af.mil (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA14154; Wed, 19 Feb 1997 08:54:18 -0600 Sender: ssampson@othello.tinker.af.mil Message-Id: <330B1419.41C6@eds.tinker.af.mil> Date: Wed, 19 Feb 1997 08:54:17 -0600 From: Steve Sampson Organization: TRW Space & Electronics X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (X11; U; AIX 1) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Einstein on Radio Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thought for the day: Einstein on Radio Albert Einstein's explanation of radio: "The telegraph is like a very very very long cat. You pull its tail in New York and its head meows in Philidelphia, you under- stand this? Radio works exactly the same except there is no cat." From jeff@mich.com Wed Feb 19 20:41:01 1997 Received: from server1.mich.com (root@server1.mich.com [198.108.16.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id UAA19006 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 1997 20:41:00 -0600 (CST) Received: from gw-aerodata.mich.com (gw-aerodata.mich.com [198.108.16.60]) by server1.mich.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id VAA12202 for ; Wed, 19 Feb 1997 21:42:45 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970220024029.00741f3c@mail.mich.com> X-Sender: jeff@mail.mich.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 19 Feb 1997 21:40:29 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: Jeff King Subject: LMR-400/LMR-600 Anyone know of anyone giving discounts on LMR-400 or LMR-600? Thanks -Jeff From sgunsel@worldnet.att.net Fri Feb 21 08:31:02 1997 Received: from mtigwc02.worldnet.att.net (mailhost.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id IAA28395 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 08:31:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from LOCALNAME ([207.147.64.61]) by mtigwc02.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA22794 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:30:29 +0000 X-Sender: sgunsel@postoffice.worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: Steve Gunsel Subject: Re: [SS:1024] FreeWave Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:30:29 +0000 Message-ID: <19970221143027.AAA22794@LOCALNAME> This is *WAY* out of my league, but I saw an interesting article in "Personal Engineering and Instrumentation News", February 1997, Vol 14 No. 2, pages 29 to 39, titled: "Technology, regs dictate multiple decisions for wireless links". This is basically a review of commercially available products for Spread spectrum devices, both 900Mhz & 2.4GHz, with prices from %50 to ???, lists of suppliers, and a summary of FCC regs. The magazine has a web page http://www.pein.com with copies of articles available for viewing/downloading. I checked today (2/21/97,9:00am) and the January, 97 issue is the latest on line. 12:10 AM 2/18/97 +0000, you wrote: >I purchased two FreeWave 915 MHz SS transceivers to evaluate under the STA. >While they were not a bargain compared to the (failed) TAPR purchase, they From wa3dsp@marconi.crompton.com Fri Feb 21 09:40:37 1997 Received: from marconi.crompton.com (wa3dsp@[204.183.201.32]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id JAA01904 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 09:40:33 -0600 (CST) Received: (from wa3dsp@localhost) by marconi.crompton.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id KAA26094; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 10:40:24 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 10:40:24 -0500 (EST) From: Doug Crompton To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: Any TAPR Group Purchase In-Reply-To: <32F40856.AEB2048@ici.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sorry if this is a repeat topic but I have not been following. I was attempting to purchase the TAPR offered SS Box. I have great difficulty getting into the TAPR phone system. That is talking to a real person and my messsge(s) left there are not returned. Forget if I tried email. Anyhow - Is the buy dead? If so is there anything else planned? 73 Doug ********************************* * Doug Crompton * * Richboro, PA 18954 * * 215-355-5307 * * * * doug@crompton.com * * wa3dsp@wa3dsp.ampr.org * * http://www.crompton.com * ********************************* From wa3dsp@marconi.crompton.com Fri Feb 21 12:50:15 1997 Received: from marconi.crompton.com (wa3dsp@[204.183.201.32]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id MAA11240 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 12:50:12 -0600 (CST) Received: (from wa3dsp@localhost) by marconi.crompton.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id NAA27330; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 13:49:55 -0500 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 13:49:55 -0500 (EST) From: Doug Crompton To: ss@tapr.org cc: Thomas Jim Subject: Re: Tapr SS Purchase In-Reply-To: <199702211823.NAA25531@po_box.cig.mot.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On 21 Feb 1997, Thomas Jim wrote: > It seems that the purchase agreement of Freewave RF modems was completely > cancelled by Freewave. The discussions lately on the ss list has been mainly > on what to do now instead. Primarily it has centered on trying to build a SS > modularized setup. Some people had already purchased other SS gear such as > WaveLAN PC cards and are already testing. I am more interested in using whats > available myself, to do high speed packet linking, than trying to do design > work. If they come up with an easy to build and cheap approach, I may try to > build a pair for testing. > 73 de Jim Thomas N9MOO (VP Chicago Area Packet Radio Association) > > I agree, although I am willing to spend some money. I was going to buy two of the TAPR Freewave's. Are there group (quantity) purchase prices for the Wavelan cards? What other options are there? Doug ********************************* * Doug Crompton * * Richboro, PA 18954 * * 215-355-5307 * * * * doug@crompton.com * * wa3dsp@wa3dsp.ampr.org * * http://www.crompton.com * ********************************* From RLANIER@mailb.harris.com Fri Feb 21 13:26:25 1997 Received: from sol.corp.Harris.COM (sol.corp.harris.com [137.237.104.14]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id NAA12387 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 13:26:21 -0600 (CST) Received: from mailb.harris.com by sol.corp.Harris.COM (8.6.12/Kurts Special version 2.0) id OAA27946; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:26:13 -0500 Received: from ccMail by mailb.harris.com (IMA Internet Exchange 1.04b) id 30df6920; Fri, 21 Feb 97 14:25:06 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 11:12:47 -0500 Message-ID: <30df6920@mailb.harris.com> From: RLANIER@mailb.harris.com (RLANIER) Subject: Re: [SS:1013] Goals To: ss@tapr.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part >Permits spread spectrum emissions on amateur radio bands 50-54 MHz, >144-148 MHz, 219-220 MHz and 222-225 MHz; >Provides for transmission of hybrid spread spectrum emissions; and >Permits the use of other spreading codes. >With that said, I'll throw out a couple of suggestions. What about voice >comms? No computer, protocol stacks, or arcane networking knowledge >needed. Just a CODEC driving the unit and you are on your way. Technology >might be easily cobbled from SS cordless phones. I really like the idea of >a unit that puts out a nice IF like Robert's design. With transverters we >could get up in many different bands and see who we affect. Might even be >able to involve some of the weak signal guys who normally use transverters >in their designs. >Lee W. Fry AA0JP I think Lee also favors doing a modular project. The transverters could be designed by those who have more RF experience. This would permit us to use the above mentioned frequecy bands. Once we have a good IF, it can used for despreading and then digitally processed. The same is true for transmitting. A modular approach, using different groups of people assigned to a task, would be possible. Are we going to do it or not? Tony KE4ATO From buaas@wireless.net Fri Feb 21 15:05:55 1997 Received: from wireless.net (wireless.net [198.253.254.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id PAA18017 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 15:05:52 -0600 (CST) Received: (from root@localhost) by wireless.net (8.7.6/8.6.12) id NAA29602 for ss@tapr.org; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 13:25:28 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 13:25:28 -0800 (PST) From: "Robert A. Buaas" Message-Id: <199702212125.NAA29602@wireless.net> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: WaveLAN Product availability Doug (and Gang)-- I've been working on busting down the (price) door at Lucent (ex AT&T, ex NCR), to get some decent prices for the WaveLAN products. I have not succeeded terribly well, but at least the door is open. I can provide 2.4 Gz ISA WaveLAN cards at $599 each. I've also opened a path for the WaveMODEM (the RF modem daughter module, I believe, that sits on the WaveLAN ISA motherboard). These are available at $499 each. These are qty-1 prices, and if I can get together a group purchase, there's a (remote) possibility of getting a slightly lower price depending on the volume. I don't have a firm price yet on 915 MHz ISA cards, but they are looking like ~$525 each. This certainly is not the deal we had with the limited quantity overstock/pullout's, unfortunately. Still, is there any interest? If so, please email me direct, to minimize traffic on the list. (buaas@wireless.net) Details on the cards can be had at http://www.wavelan.com, and follow the products thread. The WaveMODEM is a tricky gadget to program. I was able to get the databook for it's 20-pin interface. It's 58-pages (29 double-sided), and available only on paper. (I tried to get a .pdf, but no luck. Still trying.) In addition to the usual modem control signals, it requires a 3-wire bidirectional serial interface for programming internal registers. If you have interest in using the modem stand-alone, I suggest reading the source code for either the Linux or FreeBSD driver to get a sense of the complexity. This is NOT a simple gadget to program. This gadget transmits at +15 dBm, received successfully at -80 dBm input. Bob Myers Associates (Phoenix) sells some very nice 2'x3' parabolic antennas (beamwidth 7.5-deg, ~23 dBd gain). Longest distance reported to date is 10-miles at full throughput. best regards/bob K6KGS From lfry@mindspring.com Fri Feb 21 16:37:19 1997 Received: from mailmule1.mindspring.com (mailmule1.mindspring.com [204.180.128.192]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id QAA24160 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 16:37:14 -0600 (CST) Received: from glory (user-168-121-136-107.dialup.mindspring.com [168.121.136.107]) by mailmule1.mindspring.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id RAA15255 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 17:37:13 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970221223936.0038ed40@mindspring.com> X-Sender: lfry@mindspring.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 17:39:36 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: "Lee W. Fry" Subject: CruiseLan Looking through my new MECI catalog I see Zenith "Cruiselan Antenna with board", part no ALN-1010-00 at $299.95. This looks like it may be the Zenith version of the RangeLan at a good price. Lee W. Fry AA0JP lfry@mindspring.com See my Part 15 Spread Spectrum Device Compendium at: http://www.mindspring.com/~lfry/part15.htm From fields@svpal.org Fri Feb 21 17:04:05 1997 Received: from svpal.svpal.org (root@svpal.svpal.org [204.118.32.56]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA25676 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 17:04:02 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fields@localhost) by svpal.svpal.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) id OAA00886; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:15:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 14:15:19 -0800 (PST) From: Julian Fields Subject: Low cost CAD for RF/SS? To: ss@tapr.org In-Reply-To: <9702182031.AA19452@gate.rmcs.cranfield.ac.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII What do people use to simulate the RF section of a rcvr/xmtr? Spice? other? What is the common PCB layout tool for the person on a budget? Orcad? Are any of the University CAD tools for RF any good or worth downloading? FIELDS@SVPAL.ORG Home email account of Julian Fields. From clearbrook_technical@mindlink.bc.ca Fri Feb 21 18:59:48 1997 Received: from linux.clrtech.com. (excel13.jumppoint.com [204.191.232.138]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id SAA01102 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 18:59:46 -0600 (CST) Received: from fk-shop.clrtech.com (fk-shop.clrtech.com [172.17.20.101]) by linux.clrtech.com. (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA02184 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 16:59:11 -0800 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 16:59:11 -0800 Message-Id: <199702220059.QAA02184@linux.clrtech.com.> X-Sender: clearbrook_technical@linux.clrtech.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: Fred Kehler Subject: Wavelan driver Hi all, the radio stats from the linux wavelan driver, in the /proc/net/wavelan file seem to be in the range 0 - ff for signal level, silence and quality, does anyone have some info on how these are derived? ie are they calibrated to anything or just relative values? I am seeing something like signal level =cd silence =c1 quality, bounces from 7f to ff.. this is for a 6 (10km) link with 11db antennas also there is a variable being set in the driver from antenna type, i don't remember the exact variable name..can anyone comment on that? thanks Fred Kehler (ve7ipb) Clearbrook Technical Services Ltd. clearbrook_technical@mindlink.bc.ca. From beltrani@hawaii.edu Fri Feb 21 21:59:57 1997 Received: from relay1.Hawaii.Edu (root@relay1.Hawaii.Edu [128.171.3.53]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA09629 for ; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 21:59:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu ([128.171.44.54]) by relay1.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <587344(4)>; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 17:55:53 -1000 Received: from localhost by uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <216719(7)>; Fri, 21 Feb 1997 17:59:33 -1000 Date: Fri, 21 Feb 1997 17:59:29 -1000 From: Paul A Beltrani X-Sender: beltrani@uhunix4 Reply-To: beltrani@pixi.com To: ss@tapr.org Subject: SS Chip list Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII A short while back, I mentioned I was going to put together a web page with pointers to SS chips that might be of interest to the list. The page is now available from my home page at http://www.pixi.com/~beltrani/ or directly at http://www.pixi.com/~beltrani/ss.html - Paul Beltrani, AH6NU From wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org Sat Feb 22 11:16:00 1997 Received: from wb9mjn.ampr.org (wb9mjn.ampr.org [44.72.98.19]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id LAA16634 for ; Sat, 22 Feb 1997 11:15:40 -0600 (CST) From: wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org Date: Sat, 22 Feb 97 10:38:35 UTC Message-Id: <12883@wb9mjn.ampr.org> To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Wide Band Gain Antenna... Hi All, This is related to SS, but not specifically about SS. So, please excuse the variation from the list's primary interest, please, please, hi. This week I finished up a 1270 Mhz , 8 dBd antenna, which covers the whole 1270 band with 1.6 or better VSWR. Please do not take this as a final spec, but a typical number. The final spec , could be better, but it may be worse. This antenna fits in 12 by 9 inch enclosure similar to the Ham/LAN Panel 915 antennas. If we multiply by 3, we end up with 36 by 18. Which would be the size of a 440 whole band antenna, with 2:1 or better VSWR. Yep, the whole band, with 8dBd! 420 to 450 Mhz. This is significantly better than colinear antenna bandwidths. Its is similar to multiple bay full wave loop antennas, but with out the reliability problems of corporate coaxial feeds. Now, how does this effect SS? Welp, yagis, and colinears are the type of antennas used at user stations. A multiple bay full wave loop antenna, is a bit of a large expense. Additionally, this prototype can be operated in horizontal polarisation, with a azimuthal beamwidth of the order of 70 de- grees. Multiple bay full wave loop antennas, can have the loops turned hor0 izontal, but they loose the reflection off the mast. Thus reguiring modi- fication to add a reflector mast boom at each point of the mast where there is an element. Horizontal, good F/B ratio, and gain, might be away to do SS on 440. It would attenuate most of the FM. And the F/B ratio could be put to good use keeping TV transmitters out of receivers. With the whole band for spreading, it would also keep the processing gain maximised, resulting in a minimun in- terferance to other modes. And, of course, on 1270, this antenna fills a gap. A small gain antenna, for SS users, covering the whole band. Most yagi s in this band have trouble covering the whole band. F9FT sells yagi s for the high side, and low side seperately. 60 Mhz, spread 56 KB is 28 dB processing gain. 73, Don. Mailbox : WB9MJN @ N9HSI.IL.USA.NA AMPRNet : wb9mjn@wb9mjn.ampr.org[44.72.98.19] Internet: wb9mjn%wb9mjn.ampr.org@uugate.aim.utah.edu From marius@krepro.no Sun Feb 23 17:15:59 1997 Received: from mail1.sn.no (0@mail1.sn.no [194.143.8.8]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA24990 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 17:15:57 -0600 (CST) Received: from barum6-6.ppp.sn.no (barum6-6.ppp.sn.no [194.143.6.103]) by mail1.sn.no (8.7.5/8.7.3/on4) with SMTP id for ; Mon, 24 Feb 1997 00:15:51 +0100 (MET) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 1997 00:15:51 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199702232315.AAA19588@mail1.sn.no> X-Sender: marius@pop.sn.no (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: ss@tapr.org From: marius@krepro.no (Marius Hauki) Subject: Re: [SS:1040] Low cost CAD for RF/SS? > >What do people use to simulate the RF section >of a rcvr/xmtr? Spice? other? ARRL Radio Designer is fine for a lot of stuff. If you need an unlinear simulator PSpice is a very good solution. Check out : www.microsim.com and get a free avaluation CD-ROM with full doc. that really works ! >What is the common PCB layout tool for the person >on a budget? Orcad? OrCAD sells an excellent tool for RF layouts : OrCAD Layout LTD. This package is reasonably priced and has a very good component library. In the LTD version there are no limits on component count or layers. The package is delivered without an autorouter, but you do not need one for RF work. For schematic capture I highly reccomend OrCAD Capture. It is very powerful, and easy to use and learn. All OrCAD Windows products support 3.11, 95 and NT. Check out www.orcad.com for more info ! 73 Marius Hauki LA9EEA > >Are any of the University CAD tools for RF any good >or worth downloading? > >FIELDS@SVPAL.ORG Home email account of Julian Fields. > > > From lylej@azstarnet.com Sun Feb 23 19:43:23 1997 Received: from mailhost.azstarnet.com (mailhost.azstarnet.com [169.197.1.8]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id TAA04698 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 19:43:16 -0600 (CST) Received: from tomswift (usr11ip8.azstarnet.com [169.197.12.8]) by mailhost.azstarnet.com (8.8.3-p/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA10827 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 18:37:14 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970223183742.0071307c@pop.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: lylej@pop.azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 1997 18:41:31 -0700 To: ss@tapr.org From: Lyle Johnson Subject: Re: [SS:1044] Re: Low cost CAD for RF/SS? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>What is the common PCB layout tool for the person >>on a budget? Orcad? In addition to OrCAD, you might take a look at www.ivex.com. IVex makes low cost windows-based tools that are quite cheap. The freeware evaluation version will give you a feel for what they can do. FOr $495 they are "unlimited" in size of projects. They also have other price points ($29.95 gets you anough capability for many simpler projects, 500or so "connections"). For microstrip lines and the like, PUFF is available from the University of California for about $20. Protel also has a DOS-based PCB program called Easytrax (DOS). It is freeware and unsupported. I can't comment on how good or bad it is, but the price is right. I own no stock in any of these comapnies :-) Cheers, Lyle From beltrani@hawaii.edu Sun Feb 23 21:08:47 1997 Received: from relay1.Hawaii.Edu (root@relay1.Hawaii.Edu [128.171.3.53]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id VAA09572 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 21:08:45 -0600 (CST) Received: from uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu ([128.171.44.54]) by relay1.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <587071(10)>; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 17:04:46 -1000 Received: from localhost by uhunix4.its.Hawaii.Edu with SMTP id <216722(3)>; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 17:08:32 -1000 Date: Sun, 23 Feb 1997 17:08:29 -1000 From: Paul A Beltrani X-Sender: beltrani@uhunix4 Reply-To: beltrani@pixi.com To: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1045] Re: Low cost CAD for RF/SS? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970223183742.0071307c@pop.azstarnet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sun, 23 Feb 1997, Lyle Johnson wrote: > > Protel also has a DOS-based PCB program called Easytrax (DOS). It is > freeware and unsupported. I can't comment on how good or bad it is, but > the price is right. > I use Easytrax and am very happy with it. Before you purchase anything I strongly recommend you take a look at it. It is available on the net, check out one of the SimTel mirrors or Walnut Creek CD-ROM. - Paul Beltrani From lylej@azstarnet.com Sun Feb 23 22:21:56 1997 Received: from mailhost.azstarnet.com (mailhost.azstarnet.com [169.197.1.8]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id WAA13703 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 22:21:52 -0600 (CST) Received: from tomswift (usr5ip49.azstarnet.com [169.197.6.49]) by mailhost.azstarnet.com (8.8.3-p/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA10883 for ; Sun, 23 Feb 1997 21:16:01 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970223212002.00716b74@pop.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: lylej@pop.azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Sun, 23 Feb 1997 21:20:18 -0700 To: ss@tapr.org From: Lyle Johnson Subject: Re: [SS:1046] Re: Low cost CAD for RF/SS? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" It's also located at www.protel.com for free downlaod... Cheers, Lyle At 09:10 PM 2/23/97 -0600, you wrote: > > >On Sun, 23 Feb 1997, Lyle Johnson wrote: > >> >> Protel also has a DOS-based PCB program called Easytrax (DOS). It is >> freeware and unsupported. I can't comment on how good or bad it is, but >> the price is right. >> > >I use Easytrax and am very happy with it. Before you purchase anything I >strongly recommend you take a look at it. It is available on the net, >check out one of the SimTel mirrors or Walnut Creek CD-ROM. > > - Paul Beltrani > > From fred@tekdata.com Mon Feb 24 19:44:54 1997 Received: from tekdata.com (pool10-010.wwa.com [206.222.42.11]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id TAA00804 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 1997 19:44:37 -0600 (CST) Received: (from fred@localhost) by tekdata.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) id RAA13189; Mon, 24 Feb 1997 17:05:06 -0600 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 1997 17:05:06 -0600 (CST) From: "Fred M. Spinner" To: Lyle Johnson cc: ss@tapr.org Subject: Re: [SS:1045] Re: Low cost CAD for RF/SS? In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970223183742.0071307c@pop.azstarnet.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sun, 23 Feb 1997, Lyle Johnson wrote: > >>What is the common PCB layout tool for the person > >>on a budget? Orcad? > > In addition to OrCAD, you might take a look at www.ivex.com. IVex makes > low cost windows-based tools that are quite cheap. The freeware evaluation > version will give you a feel for what they can do. FOr $495 they are > "unlimited" in size of projects. They also have other price points ($29.95 > gets you anough capability for many simpler projects, 500or so "connections"). > > For microstrip lines and the like, PUFF is available from the University of > California for about $20. I've heard of PUFF before and I am interested in it. Can someone tell me more about exactly where to get it? It can design microstrip filters, and the like, right? Fred M. Spinner. KA9VAW fred@tekdata.com From lylej@azstarnet.com Mon Feb 24 21:15:14 1997 Received: from mailhost.azstarnet.com (mailhost.azstarnet.com [169.197.1.8]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id VAA05412 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 1997 21:15:08 -0600 (CST) Received: from tomswift (usr5ip63.azstarnet.com [169.197.6.63]) by mailhost.azstarnet.com (8.8.3-p/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA04085 for ; Mon, 24 Feb 1997 20:09:15 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970224201305.00713200@pop.azstarnet.com> X-Sender: lylej@pop.azstarnet.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 1997 20:13:37 -0700 To: ss@tapr.org From: Lyle Johnson Subject: Re: [SS:1048] Re: Low cost CAD for RF/SS? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Fred, >I've heard of PUFF before and I am interested in it. Can someone tell >me more about exactly where to get it? > >It can design microstrip filters, and the like, right? See "http://www.systems.caltech.edu/EE/Faculty/rutledge/puff.html" for information, how to order, what it does, etc. Costs $10. >From the manual, "PUFF is a scattering parameter and layout calculator for microwave circuits." You use it to design and verify the board microstirp lines, etc. Then you do the actual PCB layout in soem other program. Puff plots graphics, but PC houses want Gerber, and no one actually shoots film from a plot these days :-) Enjoy! Lyle From wd5ivd@tapr.org Wed Feb 26 11:45:40 1997 Received: from [208.134.134.40] ([208.134.134.40]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id LAA09590 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 1997 11:45:38 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Feb 1997 11:40:54 -0600 To: " Spread Spectrum " From: wd5ivd@tapr.org Subject: Harris Intros PRISM Kit I just got sent this. Cheers - Greg ------ Harris Intros PRISM Kit Source: Electronic Buyers' News Electronic Buyers' News via Individual Inc. : Fremont, Calif. - Harris Corp. has introduced a reference design kit for its PRISM direct-sequence spread-spectrum (DSSS) wireless LAN transceiver chip set. The kit is intended to give OEM designers tools to concurrently develop device drivers, applications software, and hardware for IEEE 802.11-compliant products. The idea is to slash development time for a range of wireless products, according to Chris Henningsen, director of the Melbourne, Fla., chip maker's wireless, video, and multimedia marketing. Harris, which launched its four-chip PRISM chip set in late 1995, sees a major opportunity in the spread-spectrum business. Henningsen cited research from Integrated Circuit Engineering Corp., Scottsdale, Ariz., predicting that the wireless LAN market will increase from $745 million this year to $1.9 billion five years from now. The reference design kit, called the WLANKITPRI-EVAL, gives OEM-designed hardware and software the capability of implementing a 2-Mbit/s DSSS wireless LAN in the 2.4-GHz Industrial-Scientific-Medical band. About 18 months after its launch, the PRISM chip set remains the industry's only prepackaged DSSS solution, according to a Harris spokesman. The evaluation kit includes two FCC-approved Type 2 PC Card wireless LAN cards with integral antennas, as well as driver and media-access-controller software and a pair of single-user licenses. The kit offers Windows-compatible diagnostic software for measurement and display of packet error rate and throughput. The PRISM DSSS chip set was a gamble for Harris, according to Henningsen. Development costs were high, and the market has been slower to take off than expected, he said. But the wireless LAN market can look forward to compound average annual growth of more than 100% through 1999, according to Dataquest Inc., San Jose. In Harris' past fiscal year, sales of the chip set reached $36 million, and the company expects $100 million in orders by 1998. The WLANKITPRI-EVAL design kit is available for $995. From wd5ivd@tapr.org Wed Feb 26 13:20:53 1997 Received: from [208.134.134.40] ([208.134.134.40]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id NAA14897; Wed, 26 Feb 1997 13:20:47 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 26 Feb 1997 13:15:45 -0600 To: " Spread Spectrum " From: wd5ivd@tapr.org Subject: Hedy Lamarr Gets Her Due -- As a Wireless-Broadcast Pioneer Cc: "Steven N7HPR Bible" I had this sent to me and thought that many of you would like to see it. Cheers - Greg ------ The Wall Street Journal Interactive Edition -- February 19, 1997 Hedy Lamarr Gets Her Due -- As a Wireless-Broadcast Pioneer By MARK BOSLET Dow Jones News Services PALO ALTO, Calif. -- Hollywood promoted her as the "most beautiful girl in the world," but some electrical engineers think of Hedy Lamarr as more than just a pretty face. The Austrian actress, whose career hit its zenith in the 1940s, patented a wireless broadcast technology that has suddenly caught the interest and imagination of today's engineering community. While some scientists readily point to Ms. Lamarr's 1942 patent as the foundation for spread-spectrum technology -- she received the patent with composer George Antheil -- few in the wireless-communication industry know of the screen star's contribution. Ms. Lamarr is a "huge part of the history of this industry," said Proxim Inc. Chief Executive David C. King, whose company first introduced a circuit board using spread-spectrum technology in 1989 and now has hundreds of products based on it. Qualcomm Inc. Vice Chairman Andrew J. Viterbi is equally complimentary. Qualcomm's cellular phones use a form of spread spectrum that differs somewhat from the Lamarr and Antheil concept. However, in many other applications of spread spectrum, the "fundamental concept is the same" today, Mr. Viterbi said. The patent granted to Ms. Lamarr and Mr. Antheil, who had no technical training in electronics, outlined a procedure for shielding radio-controlled torpedoes from German signal jamming in World War II. The technique called for the use of devices similar to player-piano rolls installed shipboard and inside the torpedoes. Mr. Antheil, who was considered the "bad boy" of music in his day for his iconoclastic compositions that called for musical performances by machines, had synchronized two piano rolls for an adaptation of his 1923 Ballet Mech anic and drew on that work for the shielding concept. The idea was simple: use the piano rolls to skip from one frequency to the next in random order, much as a piano performance moves from one note to the next. The enemy does not know which frequency will come up next. This concept came to be called frequency hopping and was turned over to the military during the war. But it did not make its debut until the Cuban Missile Crisis, when it was used for radio communications. It led to the modern-day notion of spread spectrum: the spreading of a signal among many frequencies to prevent interference, eavesdropping or jamming. Proponents also cite it as a way for numerous users to share the airwaves. At first, coming up with sophisticated systems to synchronize two or more transmitters proved a costly hurdle. However, with advances in semiconductor technology, and the increased power of low-cost digital signal processors, spread spectrum stepped from a technology used by deep-pocketed operations such as the military into much wider use. Commercial products began coming to market in the 1980s. It is now used in cordless and cellular phones, in alarm systems and military radios, in global-positioning system satellites and in linking portable and desktop computers wirelessly to corporate networks. Ms. Lamarr's interest in a device to protect torpedoes stemmed from a failed marriage to Austrian munitions magnate Fritz Mandl, a maker of bombs, bullets and torpedoes for Hitler's war machine. Mr. Mandl would often have fellow weapons builders over for dinner, and when Ms. Lamarr fled Austria and an overly possessive Mr. Mandl in advance of World War II, she took her memories of all this talk of "rockets and radios" with her, said Anthony Loder, Ms. Lamarr's son. The most recent round of enthusiasm for spread spectrum has roots in last month's Federal Communications Commission decision to set aside more frequencies for spread spectrum, allowing for more-powerful broadcasts. Companies now see the technology bringing telephone, television and computer-data transmissions to neighborhoods or remote villages using a single nearby antenna, eliminating the high cost of having to string out wires. "I see an incredible market," said Dan Maxwell, vice president of World Wireless Communications Inc., adding that interest in the technology has "gone bonkers." The cost savings are potentially huge, a consideration especially important in emerging countries where investment capital may be scarce, said David R. Hughes, who helped put together a Lamarr home page on the Web. Mr. Hughes envisions the technology providing an inexpensive way for schools to link themselves to one another and to the Internet, especially in remote communities. Ms. Lamarr, now 83 and her image sullied by two shoplifting arrests and a reputation for being difficult, has become a recluse living in Altamonte, Fla. She apparently turned down an award for her patent because it meant appearing before Congress. Mr. Hughes believes it is time for Ms. Lamarr to receive recognition for her work. He has proposed she receive an award from the Electronic =46rontier Foundation, a group addressing Internet-privacy issues, and notes that she wouldn't have to attend the presentation. Copyright =A9 1997 Dow Jones & Company, Inc. All Rights Reserved. From lbush@eramp.net Wed Feb 26 16:07:58 1997 Received: from www (www.eramp.net [206.149.42.1]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with SMTP id QAA23319 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 1997 16:07:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from default by www (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA17305; Wed, 26 Feb 1997 16:06:30 -0600 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970226220910.006d4f28@eramp.net> X-Sender: lbush@eramp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Feb 1997 16:09:10 -0600 To: ss@tapr.org From: Larry Bush Subject: Re: [SS:1051] Hedy Lamarr Gets Her Due -- As a Wireless-Broadcast Pioneer At 01:31 PM 2/26/97 -0600, you wrote: >I had this sent to me and thought that many of you would like to see it. > >Cheers - Greg > >------ > >The Wall Street Journal Interactive Edition -- February 19, 1997 > > >Hedy Lamarr Gets Her Due -- >As a Wireless-Broadcast Pioneer > FYI The magazine, American Heritage of Invention & Technology, Volume 12/Number 4, has Hedy Lamarr on front cover and story includes copies of original patent. 73... Larry Bush, W5NCD 359 Arrowhead Point Waco, Texas 76712 phone 817-848-5155 Fax # 817-299-1040 From jeff@mich.com Wed Feb 26 17:00:04 1997 Received: from server1.mich.com (root@server1.mich.com [198.108.16.2]) by tapr.org (8.7.5/8.7.3/1.9) with ESMTP id RAA25755 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 1997 17:00:03 -0600 (CST) Received: from gw-aerodata.mich.com (gw-aerodata.mich.com [198.108.16.60]) by server1.mich.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id SAA02608 for ; Wed, 26 Feb 1997 18:01:24 -0500 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19970226225928.0071fa30@mail.mich.com> X-Sender: jeff@mail.mich.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 26 Feb 1997 17:59:28 -0500 To: ss@tapr.org From: Jeff King Subject: Re: [SS:1050] Harris Intros PRISM Kit Greg: Harris also has another eval kit with SMA connectors and PCMCIA extenders included. Its $1395 and recommended for hardware developers. They (Harris) will shortly be introducing a ISA based development kit as well. -Jeff wb8wka At 11:50 AM 2/26/97 -0600, wd5ivd@tapr.org wrote: >I just got sent this. Cheers - Greg > >------ > >Harris Intros PRISM Kit > Clip >The reference design kit, called the WLANKITPRI-EVAL, gives OEM-designed >hardware and software the capability of implementing a 2-Mbit/s DSSS >wireless LAN in the 2.4-GHz Industrial-Scientific-Medical band. Clip > >The evaluation kit includes two FCC-approved Type 2 PC Card wireless LAN >cards with integral antennas, as well as driver and > Clip >The WLANKITPRI-EVAL design kit is available for $995. >